The difficulty of making something new

Whenever I make a FOSS social media, alternative to Discord or whatever, people reject it aggressively.

每当我制作自由开源软件社交媒体，以替代 Discord 或其他任何东西时，人们都会强烈拒绝它。

It wasn't like this in 2004 when I made websites and phpBB communities. Back then it was "build it and they will come", now it's "fuck off with your shit reddit clone."

2004年我做网站和phpBB社区的时候可不是这样的。那时是“构建它，他们就会来”，现在是“滚蛋吧你的 Reddit 克隆”。

Most people wont click links to my website because it's "sus". Like, when I link a video to some friend on Discord, she will ask me to upload it on Youtube instead. To me it's insane that a non-profit open source site that doesn't even use cookies is seen as suspicious but known data harvesting machines get the thumbs up. There is some deep psychological revelation to be found here.

大多数人不会点击我网站的链接，因为它是“sus”。例如，当我在 Discord 上将视频链接到某个朋友时，她会要求我将其上传到 Youtube 上。 对我来说，一个甚至不使用 cookies 的非盈利开源网站被视为可疑，但已知的数据收集机器却得到了竖起大拇指，这太疯狂了。这里有一些深刻的心理启示。

Tiktok is probably the most disgusting site I've ever seen. The front page even straight up says they don't respect GDPR and you have to click "ok" to agree. Do you understand how insane this is to me? Do people even read or process what they read? The amount of blind trust "because it's corpo" is reaching unfathomable heights. Next to this openly dystopian hellhole is a completely transparent no-strings-attached website and people don't just ignore it, they get violent. When people see my projects they don't just say they're not interested, they get hostile and defensive. Like whenever I tell people Discord might not be the most user-friendly platform anymore, they hiss at me and turtle back deeper into their cushy Nitro account and Hololive servers they will never leave no matter what Discord inc does to them.

Tiktok 可能是我见过的最恶心的网站。首页甚至直接说他们不尊重 GDPR，你必须单击“确定”才能同意。你知道这对我来说有多疯狂吗？人们是否会阅读或处理他们所读到的内容？ “因为它是企业”的盲目信任已经达到了难以想象的高度。在这个公开的反乌托邦地狱旁边是一个完全透明的无附加条件的网站，人们不仅会忽视它，还会变得暴力。当人们看到我的项目时，他们不仅会说不感兴趣，还会变得充满敌意和防御性。就像每当我告诉人们 Discord 可能不再是最用户友好的平台时，他们都会对我发出嘶嘶声，然后深入他们舒适的 Nitro 帐户和 Hololive 服务器，无论 Discord 公司对他们做什么，他们都永远不会离开。

Other devs out there? How have you solved this issue? Getting any project off the ground in 2026 seems like a nightmare even when you're trying to do the right thing.

还有其他开发人员吗？你是如何解决这个问题的？即使您试图做正确的事情，在 2026 年启动任何项目似乎都是一场噩梦。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787050638463244.png

>network effect

>网络效应

People have been conditioned into thinking that there should only be 1 website and 1 private messaging platform in the world.

人们已经习惯性地认为世界上应该只有 1 个网站和 1 个私人消息平台。

People think more is better: more users and more content.

人们认为越多越好：更多的用户和更多的内容。

They don't understand the result of more users is that it's harder to make friends, and the result of infinite content is brainfog and doomscrolling without acually giving a fuck about the content.

他们不明白更多用户的结果是更难交朋友，而无限内容的结果是脑雾和末日滚动，而没有真正关心内容。

When people encounter a new site they think they're expected to migrate and abandon their current digs.

当人们遇到一个新地点时，他们认为他们应该迁移并放弃当前的住所。

Why can't you just use all of them?

为什么不能全部使用呢？

>youtube is better than odysee

>youtube 比 odysee 更好

Why can't you use both?

为什么不能两者都使用？

>>109585927

>Like whenever I tell people Discord might not be the most user-friendly platform anymore

>就像每当我告诉人们 Discord 可能不再是最用户友好的平台一样

You're just a pretentious asshole. If you told me shit like that unprompted I'd just block you. You're exactly like a fucking jenovah witness.

你只是一个自命不凡的混蛋。如果你不经意间告诉我这样的废话，我就会拉黑你。你就像一个该死的耶和华见证人。

>>109586156

>jenovah

* Janova

* 贾诺瓦

>>109586156

>just rage again

> 再次愤怒

Didn't I predict in my opening post that you'd get hostile and violent towards me just from insinuating that I've made a website / app ?

我在开篇文章中难道没有预测到，仅仅因为暗示我制作了一个网站/应用程序，您就会对我产生敌意和暴力吗？

Can you calm your emotions down to a level where you could explain to me what prompts this uncontrolled PMS rampage?

您能否将自己的情绪平静下来，以便向我解释是什么导致了这种不受控制的经前综合症的狂暴？

For instance, tell me in which ways I'm a "fucking pretentious asshole" who deserves to be blocked and Zuckerberg, Musk, Tiktok guy, new Moot etc. are not.

例如，告诉我在哪些方面我是一个“他妈的自命不凡的混蛋”，应该被屏蔽，而扎克伯格、马斯克、Tiktok 家伙、新 Moot 等则不然。

t. OP

>>109586156

Are you saying your app of choice is a personal decision that defines your life to such a degree that you'd compare it to a religion?

您是说您选择的应用程序是个人决定，它定义了您的生活，以至于您会将其与宗教进行比较？

Jesus man.

耶稣人。

>>109585927

Zoomers don't know how links or files or the internet or the web works so of course it makes some things harder. But 'fuck off with your shit reddit clone' means you have an upboot system or other nonsense. The problem is you're conflating many things together though they are different issues.

Zoomers 不知道链接、文件、互联网或网络是如何工作的，所以这当然会让一些事情变得更加困难。但是“滚蛋吧你的 Reddit 克隆”意味着你有一个启动系统或其他废话。问题是你将许多事情混为一谈，尽管它们是不同的问题。

Here's a tip for a start: identify what problem you are solving with your forum or whatever. What is it doing that can't be done better elsewhere? If your answer is "we have better users" well you're fully banking on network effect alone. You will have to use another approach, such as maybe start by making a thin interface to another community or communities and bridging messages across them, but applying your special rules to incoming and outgoing message to curate their content in such a way that can showcase the quality standards you hold.

这是一个开始的提示：确定您正在通过论坛或其他方式解决什么问题。它在做什么其他地方无法做得更好的事情？如果您的答案是“我们有更好的用户”，那么您完全依赖于网络效应。您将不得不使用另一种方法，例如可能首先为另一个或多个社区创建一个精简接口，并在它们之间桥接消息，但将您的特殊规则应用于传入和传出消息，以能够展示您所持有的质量标准的方式管理其内容。

Otherwise, you can absolutely win on technical grounds. You need to learn patience, 4chan did not succeed in 1 day and neither will you. But so long as you have an edge, it will work out. If you solve nothing, then go cry about it somewhere else though.

否则，你绝对可以在技术上获胜。你需要学会耐心，4chan 没有在 1 天之内成功，你也不会。但只要你有优势，它就会成功。如果你解决不了任何问题，那就去别的地方哭吧。

>>109585948

People readily use multiple sites - if there is a reason to. People use youtube and they use 4chan (for example). God forbid, some even use, dare I say, redd!t along with 4chan despite both being text-based forums in the end.

人们很容易使用多个网站——如果有理由的话。人们使用 YouTube，也使用 4chan（例如）。上帝禁止，我敢说，有些人甚至使用 redd!t 和 4chan，尽管它们最终都是基于文本的论坛。

People just don't migrate if there is no reason to because they can get everything else where they already are.

如果没有理由，人们就不会迁移，因为他们可以在现有的地方获得其他一切。

>>109586156

wtf dude what are you even angry about

wtf 老兄你到底在生气什么

>>109586777

Thank you anon. My website sort of tackles many if not most of the issues of social media. I'm shit at marketing so I don't know which of these to make the main point of my site. I just code.

谢谢你。我的网站解决了社交媒体的许多（如果不是大部分）问题。我不擅长营销，所以我不知道我的网站应该以哪一个为重点。我只是编码。

>non-profit so it doesnt need to collect your data and addict you (fixes the typical toxic dynamic of social media business models)

>非营利性，因此不需要收集您的数据并使您上瘾（修复社交媒体商业模式的典型有毒动态）

>open source (transparent)

>开源（透明）

>has been coded without modern frameworks so it's ultra lightweight and runs on devices almost 20 years old (fixes planned obsolence and the e-waste problem where people toss away phones every 2 years because tiktok no longer works)

>在没有现代框架的情况下进行编码，因此它非常轻量级，并且可以在近 20 年历史的设备上运行（修复了计划报废和电子垃圾问题，即人们每两年就扔掉手机，因为 tiktok 不再起作用）

Basically I'm attempting to offer all the basic services people use daily (dm's, content posting, making new communities) but without the catch.

基本上，我试图提供人们日常使用的所有基本服务（DM、内容发布、创建新社区），但没有任何问题。

Someone told me I should market this lightweight social media to developing countries where people might have poor Internet connection and old devices.

有人告诉我，我应该向发展中国家推销这种轻量级社交媒体，因为那里的人们可能互联网连接较差且设备陈旧。

>>109586868

Also, I've been told in the past that Mastodon and Bluesky already exist

另外，我过去听说乳齿象和蓝天已经存在

But I dont think that's a good way to think about these things. Otherwise we end up on the "there is only 1 website in the world" path again.

但我认为这不是思考这些事情的好方法。否则我们最终会再次走上“世界上只有 1 个网站”的道路。

The web should be a patchwork of small sites people have made by themselves.

网络应该是人们自己制作的小网站的拼凑而成。

I dont even want millions of users and I think it's dumb.

我什至不想要数百万用户，我认为这很愚蠢。

There should be a hardcap of like 10k users and then the site won't accept new registrations.

应该有大约 10k 用户的硬上限，然后该网站将不再接受新的注册。

>>109586868

You are building a solution in search of a problem. You are describing technical (even the entity structure you emphasize its TECHNICAL merits over other options) benefits of what you're doing, but not how that addresses any problem, or how that aligns to what people want to do. In other words, you're thinking about everything backward.

您正在构建一个解决方案来寻找问题。您正在描述您正在做的事情的技术优势（甚至是您强调其相对于其他选项的技术优点的实体结构），但不是描述它如何解决任何问题，或者如何与人们想要做的事情保持一致。换句话说，你在思考一切事情。

The point of a forum is to exchange messages. Typically, those are text messages between multiple people, with tree-like organization.

论坛的目的是交换信息。通常，这些是多人之间的文本消息，具有树状组织。

People use forums for various reasons: for entertainment, for exchanging information, to learn things, to socialize, etc.

人们使用论坛的原因有多种：娱乐、交换信息、学习、社交等。

Thus, a better forum is one that is better along one of the above dimensions. For example, one that allows sharing entertainment easier, such as with better integration in video sites and videogames with an overlay system and the ability to quick-screenshot and caption; or one that makes it easier to have deep conversations because the edit forms are optimize for that format (no keeping a tab of the thread and another tab for the reply as in phpbb sites, nor having to reshape the QR box on 4chan, etc.) with integration for better pdf and website preview/inline annotation/whatever; or you find out a good way to let people simultaneously share contact details such as steam or discord IDs while posting fully anonymously otherwise.

因此，一个更好的论坛是在上述维度之一上更好的论坛。例如，可以更轻松地共享娱乐，例如通过覆盖系统更好地集成视频网站和视频游戏以及快速屏幕截图和字幕的能力；或者更容易进行深入对话，因为编辑表单针对该格式进行了优化（不需要像 phpbb 网站那样保留一个线程选项卡和另一个用于回复的选项卡，也不必重塑 4chan 上的 QR 框等），并集成更好的 pdf 和网站预览/内联注释/其他；或者您找到了一种好方法，可以让人们同时分享联系方式，例如 Steam 或 Discord ID，同时以完全匿名的方式发帖。

These are 'better mousetrap' ideas. These work, though they're a hard sell because you have to be at least 10x better than the next better option to win.

这些都是“更好的捕鼠器”的想法。这些方法很有效，但很难推销，因为你必须比下一个更好的选择至少好 10 倍才能获胜。

Otherwise you have to identify a problem with forums. To me, that would be low quality posts (twitter screencaps, ragebait spam, etc.) and the lack of places where it's possible to have a nuanced discussion (instead of 'ur dum no ur dum' or 'ur politician is senile no ur politician is senile' spam garbage).

否则，您必须确定论坛的问题。对我来说，这将是低质量的帖子（推特屏幕截图、愤怒诱饵垃圾邮件等），并且缺乏可以进行细致讨论的地方（而不是“你的政客不是你的政客”或“你的政治家是老年的，你的政治家是老年的”垃圾邮件垃圾）。

Then you have to prove how that can't happen on your site, without saying "trust me bro" (that is a very hard problem, obviously).

然后，您必须证明这种情况不可能在您的网站上发生，而无需说“相信我，兄弟”（显然，这是一个非常困难的问题）。

>>109586903

Mastodon is basically a system where everyone makes a small site, but the small sites can talk to each other. It was a good point.

Mastodon 基本上是一个系统，每个人都创建一个小站点，但小站点可以相互通信。这是一个很好的观点。

>There should be a hardcap of like 10k users and then the site won't accept new registrations.

>应该有大约 10k 用户的硬上限，然后该网站将不再接受新的注册。

10k is generally not enough to have any kind of discussion in an international community. It only works if you're looking at super local stuff. Consider how many topics can even exist that people might be looking to discuss, and the level of each discussion, and the subtopics... and people can just go anywhere else to have it all then.

10k 通常不足以在国际社区进行任何形式的讨论。它仅在您查看超级本地内容时才有效。考虑一下人们可能想要讨论的主题数量、每个讨论的级别以及子主题……然后人们可以去其他任何地方获得所有内容。

>>109586978

Yeah even niche subreddits will have more than 10k subscribers and have less than 10 posts a day.

是的，即使是利基 Reddit 子版块也会有超过 10,000 名订阅者，但每天的帖子数量少于 10 个。

Platforms facilitating general comms don't succeed, since there's no purpose to them. Specialized places with a discussion topic can succeed, but something that relies on people generating the topics are too general for people to bother.

促进通用通信的平台不会成功，因为它们没有目的。有讨论主题的专门场所可能会成功，但依赖于人们生成主题的东西太笼统，人们不会去打扰。

>>109586978

>>109587003

I spent my entire youth on phpBB forums with 100 to 10k registered members.

我的整个青年时代都在拥有 100 到 10k 注册会员的 phpBB 论坛上度过。

I've never made as much friends. Befriending people on megasites is a myth. We didn't evolve to know a million people.

我从来没有交过这么多朋友。在大型网站上与人们交朋友是一个神话。我们并没有进化到认识一百万人。

>>109586960

>the lack of places where it's possible to have a nuanced discussion (instead of 'ur dum no ur dum' or 'ur politician is senile no ur politician is senile' spam garbage).

>缺乏可以进行细致讨论的地方（而不是“你的政治家是老年的”或“你的政治家是老年的，你的政治家是老年的”垃圾邮件垃圾）。

I think this is the biggest issue online.

我认为这是网上最大的问题。

Name one website where people have intelligent discussions. No, 4chan doesn't count. Even 4chan collapses into "ur dum no ur dum" shit very fast under certain conditions.

说出一个人们可以进行明智讨论的网站。不，4chan 不算在内。在某些条件下，甚至 4chan 也会很快崩溃成“ur dum no ur dum”。

It's like civil discussion on the Internet is physically impossible.

就像互联网上的民间讨论在物理上是不可能的一样。

I once proposed a website where you get banned for ad hominem but anons said it would restrict freedom of speech.

我曾经提议建立一个网站，禁止人身攻击，但匿名者表示这会限制言论自由。

>>109587146

The problem is always the same: how do you ensure the ad hom is really true ad hom (i.e. will the mod fly off the handle if someone calls someone else a nigger as part of a post explaining the nature of the disagreement? That wouldn't be ad hom but you can never trust power-hungry mods in practice).

问题总是一样的：你如何确保ad hom确实是真正的ad hom（也就是说，如果有人在解释分歧性质的帖子中称其他人为黑鬼，mod会发疯吗？这不会是ad hom，但在实践中你永远不能相信权力饥渴的mod）。

Nobody wants or has ever wanted FOSS social media

没有人想要或曾经想要自由和开源社交媒体

>>109586868

>>non-profit so it doesnt need to collect your data and addict you (fixes the typical toxic dynamic of social media business models)

>>非盈利性，因此不需要收集您的数据并使您上瘾（修复社交媒体商业模式的典型有毒动态）

>>open source (transparent)

>>开源（透明）

>>has been coded without modern frameworks so it's ultra lightweight and runs on devices almost 20 years old (fixes planned obsolence and the e-waste problem where people toss away phones every 2 years because tiktok no longer works)

>> 没有使用现代框架进行编码，因此它非常轻量级，并且可以在近 20 年历史的设备上运行（修复了计划报废和电子垃圾问题，即人们每两年就扔掉手机，因为 tiktok 不再起作用）

Nobody cares about any of this shit

没人关心这些狗屎

>>109587146

That's a human problem not a technology problem

这是人的问题而不是技术问题

>>109587281

Tons want it, but it already exists and the real problems are >>109587299

很多人想要它，但它已经存在，真正的问题是>>109587299

>>109586960

>>109585927

That's because your social media and discord clones are shit. Glad I could help.

那是因为你的社交媒体和不和谐的克隆都是狗屎。很高兴我能帮忙。

>>109585927

>I offer no value and am surprised people don't care

>我没有提供任何价值，并且很惊讶人们不关心

>>109585927

> Back then it was "build it and they will come"

> 当时是“建造它，他们就会来”

People will still consume copious amounts of porn even today, is there any evidence to the contrary? Well yes most of the platforms that weren't very specific had porn.

即使在今天，人们仍然会消费大量的色情内容，有任何证据表明相反吗？是的，大多数不是很具体的平台都有色情内容。

>>109587343

>Tons want it

>很多人都想要它

No they don't

不，他们没有

Barely any people care about this shit, you just live in an online bubble of freetards who feel the same way you do

几乎没有人关心这些狗屎，你只是生活在一群和你有同样感受的自由者的网络泡沫中

That's a very small fraction of the population

这只是人口中很小的一部分

>>109586743

he wont admit it but people literally replaced brands with religion.

他不承认，但人们确实用宗教取代了品牌。

Also i found it always strange how all npcs seemingly got the signal to use discord at the same time when it was still a tiny platform nobody used and they only use disc now refusing to use anything else newer.

而且我发现很奇怪的是，当它仍然是一个没有人使用的小平台并且他们只使用光盘而现在拒绝使用其他任何更新的东西时，所有的NPC似乎都同时收到了使用discord的信号。

I think the real underlying cause is npcs react only to perceived popularity. If you want to sell your new thing you have to market is as the hot new thing everyone is doing.

我认为真正的根本原因是NPC只对感知到的受欢迎程度做出反应。如果你想出售你的新事物，你必须将其作为每个人都在做的热门新事物进行营销。

>>109585927

The trick is not making shit for other people but rather only for yourself then letting others use it if they really feel like it (and not caring if they whine about it).

诀窍不是为别人制造屎，而只是为自己制造屎，然后让其他人使用它，如果他们真的喜欢它（而不关心他们是否抱怨它）。

>>109587404

>Also i found it always strange how all npcs seemingly got the signal to use discord at the same time when it was still a tiny platform nobody used and they only use disc now refusing to use anything else newer.

>而且我发现很奇怪的是，当它仍然是一个没有人使用的小平台并且他们只使用光盘而现在拒绝使用其他任何更新的东西时，所有的NPC似乎都同时收到了使用discord的信号。

You think it's strange that humans act in social groups? Really?

你认为人类在社会群体中的行为很奇怪吗？真的吗？

>>109587508

they were already in a social group on the existing platforms. There was no reason to mass migrate to discord. By definition disc was the smaller platform at the start of it and they still migrated to it. Demanding you use it to if you want to talk to them.

他们已经在现有平台上的社交群组中。没有理由大规模迁移到不和谐的地方。根据定义，光盘在其诞生之初是较小的平台，但他们仍然迁移到它。如果您想与他们交谈，则要求您使用它。

>>109587535

social groups migrate otherwise we'd all still be living in caves

社会群体会迁移，否则我们仍然生活在洞穴里

you don't understand basic human behaviour

你不了解人类的基本行为

>>109587586

Houses are improved caves.

房屋是经过改良的洞穴。

What improvement was disc?

光盘有何改进？

>>109586960

If I understood correctly, you're saying we should ask the people what they want. Fix some social problem before implementing tech. I think this is backwards. If you ask the users, they will want more Tiktoks. Faster, bigger, more lootboxes, more bloatware.

如果我理解正确的话，你是说我们应该询问人们想要什么。在实施技术之前解决一些社会问题。我认为这是倒退的。如果你问用户，他们会想要更多的 Tiktoks。更快、更大、更多的战利品、更多的过时软件。

No, man. We absolutely need to start with sustainable tech and then make people understand why they should want it.

不，伙计。我们绝对需要从可持续技术开始，然后让人们理解为什么他们应该想要它。

What people want and what they SHOULD WANT are two different things.

人们想要什么和他们应该想要什么是两件不同的事情。

And yes this is the part where I lose the audience because people literally just want to have their current needs catered to, for free.

是的，这就是我失去观众的部分，因为人们实际上只是想免费满足他们当前的需求。

But you have to understand that to fix social problems, like male loneliness, people want more dating apps, not realizing that dating apps made them lonely in the first place. People are not social engineering experts. Web devs are.

但你必须明白，为了解决男性孤独等社会问题，人们需要更多的约会应用程序，却没有意识到约会应用程序一开始就让他们感到孤独。人们不是社会工程专家。网络开发人员是。

>>109587281

>>109587299

Read what I just wrote above. Yes, you want Tiktok 2.0, but I don't think it's a good idea to make one. I make things I want to see in the world. I don't want to see more Tiktoks and slop.

阅读我上面刚刚写的内容。是的，你想要 Tiktok 2.0，但我认为制作一个不是一个好主意。我创造了我想在世界上看到的东西。我不想看到更多的抖音和垃圾。

>>109587354

Care to provide any arguments or is this just "ur dum" tier shit already?

愿意提供任何论据，还是这只是“你的蠢货”级别的狗屎？

>>109587404

This is 100% accurate.

这是100%准确的。

I remember when Skype was mainstream but Discord marketed itself as the cool underground place for gamers. Now it's as mainstream as can be.

我记得当 Skype 成为主流时，Discord 将自己定位为游戏玩家的酷炫地下场所。现在它已尽可能成为主流。

>>109587660

Discord's a big improvement over Skype and MSN Messenger

Discord 相对 Skype 和 MSN Messenger 有很大改进

>>109587688

>I make things I want to see in the world.

>我创造了我想在世界上看到的东西。

That's great, why are you complaining when others don't want the things you want

太好了，你想要的东西别人不想要你为什么还要抱怨呢

Yeah well I coded a software that's like teamspeak that works on web and received basically zero support

是的，我编写了一个类似于 teampeak 的软件，可以在网络上运行，但获得的支持基本上为零

So yeah I can relate

所以是的，我可以理解

People are the way they are and that's why world looks like it does but I try to make my peace with it

人就是这样，这就是为什么世界看起来就是这样，但我试图与之和平相处

>>109587691

Discord is basically just IRC with fancy CSS and a surveillance camera watching you.

Discord 基本上只是带有精美 CSS 的 IRC 和监视你的监控摄像头。

It's nothing new mate.

这不是什么新鲜事了，伙计。

>>109585927

back in 2004 niggercattle didn't have internet, they went and fucked drunk whores in frathouses

早在 2004 年，黑鬼牛就没有互联网，他们去兄弟会会堂操醉酒的妓女

market your shit to other nerds, just like you did in 2k4, or shut the fuck up about goyim not wanting to touch your site

向其他书呆子推销你的东西，就像你在 2k4 中所做的那样，或者闭嘴说非犹太人不想碰你的网站

also, delete discord, it's worse than reddit

另外，删除discord，这比reddit还糟糕

>>109587721

>new thing is just old thing with new things added to it

>新事物只是旧事物加上新事物

are you retarded?

你他妈是智障吗？

>>109587379

This. Maybe its been too long for some, or people are too young to know this, but heres the history of the internet:

这。也许对某些人来说已经太久了，或者人们还太年轻，不知道这一点，但互联网的历史如下：

> nerds (literally no one used it)

> 书呆子（实际上没有人用过它）

> nerds (nearly no one used it)

> 书呆子（几乎没有人用过它）

> nerds (still no one used it)

> 书呆子（仍然没有人使用它）

> nerds + porn (sudden explosion of users and technological advances)

> 书呆子 + 色情（用户突然爆炸和技术进步）

>Most people wont click links to my website because it's "sus".

>大多数人不会点击我网站的链接，因为它是“sus”。

I agree it's tarded when you think about it, thousands of JavaScript trackers running constantly in your browser but you are concerned about visiting a link

我同意当你想到这一点时，它已经迟到了，数千个 JavaScript 跟踪器在你的浏览器中不断运行，但你担心访问链接

>she will ask me to upload it on Youtube

>她会要求我将其上传到 Youtube 上

Maybe women really shouldn't be allowed on the internet

也许女性真的不应该被允许上网

>>109587715

I'm OP and my impression is that people mainly want to join projects only when they're already big and successful, or if there are immediate benefits like you pay them 5k a month. This paradox kills any project right at the start

我是 OP，我的印象是，人们主要只想在项目已经很大并且很成功时才加入项目，或者有立竿见影的好处，比如每月付给他们 5000 美元。这个悖论从一开始就扼杀了任何项目

People will not join any website unless it has at least 1M+ users. So how do you get those 1M people in the first place?

人们不会加入任何网站，除非该网站拥有至少 100 万以上的用户。那么，如何首先获得这 100 万人呢？

You buy them.

你买它们。

This wasnt the case in 2004. I was involved in so many team projects. We made funny parodies of anime, webcomics, websites, you name it.

2004 年的情况并非如此。我参与了很多团队项目。我们对动漫、网络漫画、网站等进行了有趣的模仿。

Whatever you pitched to the population, they joined it.

无论你向人们推销什么，他们都会加入。

Something has changed but I dont see what. Maybe it's just that there are now easier ways to get attention and entertainment than something that resembles work. In 2004, if you joined some group effort, glory was guaranteed.

有些东西发生了变化，但我不知道是什么。也许只是现在有比类似工作的事情更容易获得关注和娱乐的方式。 2004年，如果你加入一些团体的努力，荣耀是有保证的。

>>109585927

The internet is dying.

互联网正在消亡。

>>109587762

>In 2004, if you joined some group effort, glory was guaranteed.

>2004年，如果你加入了一些团体的努力，荣耀是有保证的。

You are absolutely delusional

你绝对是妄想症

>>109587769

i'm 100% convinced that in a few years only one massive website will exist and it will be horrible.

我百分百相信几年后只会存在一个大型网站，而且这将是可怕的。

>>109585927

>The difficulty of making something new

>创造新事物的难度

I get your argument anon but I'll be honest, you're not even making something really new, and if you think that making a "FOSS social media" site or "FOSS instant messaging" site is making something new you are no different than the users you are criticizing, there is so much more beyond webshit but you don't even know.

我很快就明白了你的论点，但我会说实话，你甚至没有创造出真正的新东西，如果你认为创建一个“FOSS 社交媒体”网站或“FOSS 即时消息”网站就是创造新东西，那么你和你批评的用户没有什么不同，除了网络垃圾之外还有很多东西，但你甚至不知道。

I fucking hate the web in general, it killed what the internet should have really been and now it's killing computing in general, the kind of alternative I propose don't even use a browser and are not apps, users don't even act hostile to me they respond with total confusion like I am speaking a alien language.

我他妈的讨厌整个网络，它扼杀了互联网应有的样子，现在它正在扼杀整个计算，我建议的那种替代方案甚至不使用浏览器，也不是应用程序，用户甚至不会对我表现出敌意，他们的反应完全混乱，就像我在说外星语言一样。

Computing in general has been stuck for decades in this retarded monoculture where nothing actually new is ever made, FOSS is part of the problem because they can only make clones but "free", like even Linux itself is a fucking clone of UNIX, a fucking OS from the 70's (more than 50 years ago btw)

总体而言，计算已经在这种落后的单一文化中停滞了数十年，实际上没有任何新产品诞生，FOSS 是问题的一部分，因为它们只能克隆但“免费”，就像 Linux 本身就是 UNIX 的克隆，UNIX 是 70 年代的操作系统（顺便说一句，50 多年前）

So yeah you're not even actually making anything new in the first place bro, go look at what people like Alan Kay were doing in the 60's and 70's, that's when innovation stopped in computing or better hypermedia models like project Xanadu.

所以，是的，你一开始甚至没有真正创造任何新东西，兄弟，看看像 Alan Kay 这样的人在 60 年代和 70 年代所做的事情，那时计算或更好的超媒体模型（如 Xanadu 项目）的创新停止了。

>>109587281

I have to agree with you, it's why Fediverse is retarded, they are cloning what is a corporate model built for corporate and government interests (manipulating people), but it's le "free", it's fucking pathetic.

我必须同意你的观点，这就是为什么Fediverse是弱智的，他们正在克隆为企业和政府利益（操纵人民）而建立的企业模式，但它是“自由”的，这真是太可悲了。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787068204287799.jpg

>>109587769

>>109587780

The internet is not the web, you fucking tech illiterate mongoloids.

互联网不是网络，你们这些他妈的技术文盲蒙古人。

>>109587721

Can you stream video with IRC? I personally dont use discord for anything other than streaming videos with friends. Even the friends that I use discord with, we talk on other platforms, even while streaming on discord. Mostly because of the privacy issues with discord, but also because its easier to text or video chat on the phone while watching a movie together with discord streaming on a computer.

可以使用 IRC 传输视频吗？除了与朋友串流视频外，我个人不会将不和谐用于任何其他用途。即使是和我一起使用不和谐的朋友，我们也会在其他平台上聊天，甚至在不和谐上直播时也是如此。主要是因为不和谐的隐私问题，但也因为在电脑上观看电影和不和谐流媒体时更容易在手机上发短信或视频聊天。

>>109587802

All this text but you didn't share your idea. What is it? Pic is okay though.

所有这些文字，但你没有分享你的想法。它是什么？不过图还可以。

And yes, your argument that every "new" site is the same is accurate.

是的，您关于每个“新”网站都是相同的论点是准确的。

100% of websites are just people posting text, images, videos and audio. This hasn't changed in decades.

100% 的网站只是人们发布文本、图像、视频和音频。这几十年来都没有改变。

But I claim making FOSS alternatives is a good thing, it's a no-brainer. I mean you're here, aren't you? You clearly enjoy a platform where you post text and images.

但我认为制作自由和开源软件替代品是一件好事，这是理所当然的。我的意思是你在这里，不是吗？您显然很喜欢发布文本和图像的平台。

>>109587691

its a downgrade to a regular forum.

它降级为常规论坛。

Especially when its supposed to be information exchange and not a secret ERP club. You literally hiding the information by using discord server over a regular forum.

尤其是当它应该是信息交换而不是秘密 ERP 俱乐部时。您实际上是通过在常规论坛上使用不和谐服务器来隐藏信息。

>>109587847

>its a downgrade to a regular forum.

>它降级为常规论坛。

It's not comparable to a forum, Discord is real-time, a forum is a website

它不能与论坛相比，Discord 是实时的，论坛是一个网站

>>109585927

You made a thread entitled "the difficulty of making something new," and instead talked about reimplementing things which already exist. That's a big part of the problem. Instead of trying to create something new, you're pondering how to recreate web services designed around hyper-centralization and armies of codemonkeys which keep the services live.

您创建了一个题为“创造新事物的困难”的主题，并讨论了重新实现已经存在的事物。这是问题的一个重要部分。您不再尝试创建新的东西，而是考虑如何重新创建围绕超中心化和保持服务活力的代码猴大军设计的 Web 服务。

If that's your goal, you've already lost. You have to do something actually different (aka not merely reimplement it in your language of choice) if you want to both scale it down and give people a compelling reason to use it.

如果这是你的目标，那你就已经输了。如果你想缩小规模并给人们一个令人信服的理由来使用它，你必须做一些实际上不同的事情（也就是不仅仅是用你选择的语言重新实现它）。

As for actually coming up with and making new things, the best advice I can give is to cultivate a broad range of interests (especially ones which aren't merely consuming products) and learn how to transfer ideas across very different fields. You want to maximize your ability to notice potential and missed opportunities that specialists miss. Here's some more obviously dev-related advice that I've found helpful there:

至于真正想出和创造新事物，我能给出的最好建议是培养广泛的兴趣（尤其是不仅仅是消费产品的兴趣）并学习如何在不同的领域转移想法。您希望最大限度地提高您的能力，以发现专家错过的潜在机会和错失的机会。以下是一些与开发相关的更明显的建议，我发现这些建议很有帮助：

>Familiarise yourself with old operating systems and the ideas behind them. These often had very interesting concepts which have fallen by the wayside, but could be useful if they're used in the right context

>熟悉旧操作系统及其背后的想法。这些通常有非常有趣的概念，但这些概念已被抛在一边，但如果在正确的上下文中使用它们可能会很有用

>Expose yourself to non-ALGOL programming languages

>让自己接触非 ALGOL 编程语言

>Look into E.F. Schumacher's books and his concept of intermediate technologies

>了解 E.F. Schumacher 的书籍和他的中间技术概念

>Check out Nassim Nicholas Taleb's Incerto series, and start with whatever book strikes your fancy

>查看纳西姆·尼古拉斯·塔勒布 (Nassim Nicholas Taleb) 的 Incerto 系列，然后从您喜欢的任何一本书开始

>Remind yourself that not everything in life is a software or engineering problem

>提醒自己生活中并非所有事情都是软件或工程问题

>Give yourself really high goals. Some good examples are Doug Engelbart's desire to strengthen's mankind's collective problem-solving skills and Alan Kay's wish to create Montessori-style software dev environments

>给自己设定非常高的目标。一些很好的例子是道格·恩格尔巴特（Doug Engelbart）希望加强人类集体解决问题的能力，以及艾伦·凯（Alan Kay）希望创建蒙特梭利风格的软件开发环境

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787068978667401.jpg

>>109587900

This is the biggest bunch of "Will never achieve anything" advice I've ever read

这是我读过的最大的一堆“永远不会取得任何成就”的建议

>>109587398

There are 2 kinds of people. Those who understand that free software is the only way, and animals. Animals don't deserve forums, so tons want it.

有两种人。那些明白自由软件是唯一出路的人和动物。动物不值得论坛，所以很多人都想要它。

>>109587911

How's the 200th slack clone coming along song? Killing Discord yet? How's the forum?

第 200 个 slack 克隆的歌曲怎么样？杀死不和谐了吗？论坛怎么样？

>>109587924

Ok then so why are you complaining that these "animals" don't care about your useless project

好吧，那么你为什么抱怨这些“动物”不关心你无用的项目

Go hang out with your mentally-ill FOSStard buddies and be happy

和你那些患有精神疾病的 FOSTard 好友一起出去玩吧，享受快乐的时光

>>109587846

>you didn't share your idea

>你没有分享你的想法

I don't feel like it and my ideas wouldn't fit in a post anyway, I'll be generic I have various various ideas about programming languages, operating systems and internet protocols, but since none of my ideas look like a app or a website 99% of people don't even understand what I am talking about, I envy OP, at least his users understand since hostility requires some degree of understanding.

我不喜欢它，而且我的想法无论如何也不适合在帖子中，我会很笼统，我对编程语言、操作系统和互联网协议有各种各样的想法，但由于我的想法都不像应用程序或网站，所以 99% 的人甚至不明白我在说什么，我羡慕 OP，至少他的用户理解，因为敌意需要一定程度的理解。

Because the webshit meta is so radicated in users and businesses at this point that it's just what people think computing is, yet it's actually a very limiting and badly designed platform, like you can't even do peer to peer without all kinds of dubious hacks, lol.

因为此时网络垃圾元在用户和企业中是如此根深蒂固，以至于人们认为计算就是这样，但它实际上是一个非常有限且设计糟糕的平台，就像你甚至无法在没有各种可疑黑客的情况下进行点对点，哈哈。

>100% of websites are just people posting text, images, videos and audio

>100% 的网站只是人们发布文本、图像、视频和音频

That's not even really true if you think about it, the web was born to be a hypermedia platform, which is a fancy way of saying "documents with media and with links to other documents", but what most websites are today is not documents but applications, this is the original sin of the web and now it spread like a virus to both mobile and desktop applications and to protocols too, like you have retards using JSON for config or data serialization, fucking disgusting.

如果你仔细想想，这甚至不是真的，网络生来就是一个超媒体平台，这是一种奇特的说法，“带有媒体的文档和指向其他文档的链接”，但今天大多数网站不是文档而是应用程序，这是网络的原罪，现在它像病毒一样传播到移动和桌面应用程序以及协议，就像你有使用 JSON 进行配置或数据序列化的智障一样，他妈的恶心。

>But I claim making FOSS alternatives is a good thing

>但我声称制作自由和开源软件替代品是一件好事

>I mean you're here, aren't you

>我的意思是你在这里，不是吗？

The problem I have with FOSS is that they are against building new things, they can only copy, look at any OS, DE, or applications, all clones of proprietary shit. I share their freedom oriented hacker philosophy but the movement is retarded and has always been.

我对 FOSS 的问题是，他们反对构建新事物，他们只能复制、查看任何操作系统、DE 或应用程序，所有都是专有狗屎的克隆。我认同他们以自由为导向的黑客理念，但这一运动一直以来都是迟缓的。

4chan is proprietary, and is nothing new, just a clone of Japanese anonymous boards.

4chan 是专有的，并不是什么新鲜事，只是日本匿名板的克隆。

Have another Elaina.

再来一个伊莱娜。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787069211133306.jpg

>>109587688

You should "know what they need". Asking them what they want is a way to gather data, from data you must guess the real intent (revealed preference will only show up in light of proposed solutions). You must hypothesize solutions and test them with volunteers. When you've got something, you will know.

你应该“知道他们需要什么”。询问他们想要什么是收集数据的一种方式，从数据中你必须猜测真正的意图（所显示的偏好只会根据建议的解决方案出现）。您必须假设解决方案并与志愿者一起测试它们。当你得到一些东西时，你就会知道。

But you can't just do 'what people tell you they want', because people will often describe symptoms rather than causes for obvious reasons.

但你不能只做“人们告诉你他们想做的事”，因为人们经常会出于明显的原因描述症状而不是原因。

>>109587858

>you have to hit refresh button on a forum

>你必须点击论坛上的刷新按钮

completely irrelevant when the goal is distributing information people will read days after its posted. Not to mention that hitting refresh isn't even necessary, later forums allowed realtime updates for new posts.

当目标是分发人们在发布几天后会阅读的信息时，这完全无关紧要。更不用说甚至不需要点击刷新，后来的论坛允许新帖子的实时更新。

And discord is a fucking website too.

而且不和谐也是一个该死的网站。

>>109587934

First time I made a living off my own software development efforts was 25 years ago

我第一次靠自己的软件开发谋生是在 25 年前

How about you

你呢

How are those non-ALGOL languages helping you achieve anything

这些非 ALGOL 语言如何帮助您实现目标

>>109587943

>the goal is distributing information people will read days after its posted

>目标是分发人们在发布几天后会阅读的信息

that's not the goal of Discord, or most forums really

这不是 Discord 的目标，或者大多数论坛的目标

>>109587688

>People are not social engineering experts. Web devs are.

>人们不是社会工程专家。网络开发人员是。

this is some great delulu

这是一些很棒的 delulu

>>109587937

Take your meds.

把你的药吃了。

>>109587958

I'm not a radicalized freetard I don't need any meds

我不是一个激进的自由主义者我不需要任何药物

Do a thought experiment, imagine if Discord suddenly allowed federating with XMPP. Imagine what would result from that over the next few years.

做一个思想实验，想象一下如果 Discord 突然允许与 XMPP 联合。想象一下未来几年会产生什么结果。

Such a simple thing they could do (and they could even keep charging for nitro or whatever)

他们可以做这么简单的事情（他们甚至可以继续为硝基或其他东西充电）

The internet didn't become the way it is organically, it was taken from you.

互联网并没有成为它本来的样子，而是被从你身边夺走了。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787069547992137.jpg

EVERY TIME I REFRESH THIS THREAD IT HAS 30 NEW REPLIES

>>109587967

Are the radicalized freetards in the room with us right now?

现在房间里的激进自由主义者和我们在一起吗？

I once built a classifieds site with a reddit-like discussion panel for my small municipality, but no one used it. In the distant past there was a very active forum with lively BUY/SELL section, so I wanted to build on that. From talking to people I realised that they are all on jewbook and doomscrolling between scam ads doesn't bother them

我曾经为我所在的小城市建立了一个分类网站，其中包含类似 reddit 的讨论面板，但没有人使用它。在遥远的过去，有一个非常活跃的论坛，其中有活跃的买入/卖出部分，所以我想以此为基础。通过与人们交谈，我意识到他们都在使用 jewbook，并且在诈骗广告之间滚动并不会打扰他们

>>109587769

just end it already

就结束吧

>>109587978

>Imagine what would result from that over the next few years.

>想象一下未来几年会产生什么结果。

Nobody would care

没有人会在乎

>>109587981

Yep he's right here officer >>109587937

是的，他就在这里，警官>>109587937

>>109587954

Anything close to a hobby related forum is about information exchange most users will read way later. If its pc shit then its even years later as people look for specific solutions and stumble over a forum post solving it.

任何与爱好相关的论坛都是关于信息交换的，大多数用户稍后都会阅读。如果它的电脑很糟糕，那么甚至几年后，当人们寻找特定的解决方案并偶然发现解决它的论坛帖子时。

Discord doesnt allow that. It hides all information posted on a server unless you find the server. Legacy knowledge is deleted with discord. Not to mention that it prevents search indexing.

不和谐不允许这样做。除非您找到服务器，否则它会隐藏服务器上发布的所有信息。遗留知识被不和谐地删除。更不用说它会阻止搜索索引。

>>109587815

Anyone who says discord is just IRC is so far out of the loop its pointless to engage with them.

任何说不和谐只是 IRC 的人都已经脱离了圈子，与他们接触毫无意义。

>>109587987

>the 9 gorillion people who complain abstractly about wanting to leave discord everyday but they can't because "everyone uses it"

>这9个大猩猩每天抽象地抱怨想要离开不和谐，但他们不能，因为“每个人都使用它”

>>109587992

>Anything close to a hobby related forum is about information exchange most users will read way later.

>任何与爱好相关的论坛都是关于信息交换的，大多数用户稍后都会阅读。

That represents a small minority use of forums or Discord

这代表了少数人使用论坛或 Discord

>>109587996

They don't mean it

他们不是这个意思

>>109587900

>>Give yourself really high goals. Some good examples are Doug Engelbart's desire to strengthen's mankind's collective problem-solving skills

>>给自己设定很高的目标。一些很好的例子是道格·恩格尔巴特（Doug Engelbart）希望增强人类集体解决问题的能力

Whenever I do this people say I have a god complex

每当我这样做时，人们都会说我有上帝情结

>>109587993

This is the most fascinating fact about this entire shit. Retards just want discord i.e. video, chat, file sharing with zero hassle and costs then even bigger retards come along to screech how IRC/XMPP/etc is totally the same and just run a bouncer bro, just run jitsi bro, just..

这是整个事件中最令人着迷的事实。弱智者只是想要不和谐，即零麻烦和零成本的视频、聊天、文件共享，然后更大的弱智者就会尖叫着IRC/XMPP/等是如何完全相同的，只需运行一个保镖兄弟，只需运行jitsi兄弟，就......

Both sides are fully delusional for entirely different reasons. It's fascinating.

由于完全不同的原因，双方都完全是妄想。这很有趣。

>>109588010

its not a minority, a large amount of companies started doing discord over using their own forums.

这并不是少数，大量公司开始因使用自己的论坛而产生分歧。

>>109588028

Majority use of Discord is for real-time communication

Discord 的主要用途是实时通信

Using it to archive shit is a very distant second

用它来归档垃圾是一个非常遥远的事情

GDPR and CCPA are for big websites and corporations, they are not for small and medium websites. Lots of people are stupid and refuse to click links, but anon, I'm not stupid and I'll click your links.

GDPR 和 CCPA 适用于大型网站和公司，不适用于中小型网站。很多人都很愚蠢，拒绝点击链接，但是不久之后，我并不愚蠢，我会点击你的链接。

>Tiktok

Agreed it's horrible.

同意这太可怕了。

>

Hop on matrix add me at grunit@xmr.se

跳上矩阵加我 grunit@xmr.se

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787070095294847.png

>>109585927

You'll have to swallow the bitter pill that making something is all about marketing. It doesn't matter if it's better or faster or has some unique "key differentiators" as retarded faggots on linkedin call them. It's all about dumping $700k on marketing efforts to get $750k of profits so that next time you can dump $725k on marketing to get $780k of profits... There's nothing else to it. If you don't have $700k to dump on ads to shove your new thing down everyone's throats - you will get a tightly knit community of 200 stunted retards with no money or anything interesting going on in their lives. Making a product is not about technology at all.

你将不得不吞下苦果：制作东西全都与营销有关。它是否更好、更快，或者是否有一些独特的“关键差异化因素”（LinkedIn 上的弱智基佬们这样称呼它们）并不重要。这一切都是为了在营销上投入 70 万美元，以获得 75 万美元的利润，这样下次你就可以在营销上投入 72.5 万美元，以获得 78 万美元的利润……没有其他的了。如果你没有 70 万美元的广告费来把你的新东西强行塞给每个人，你就会得到一个由 200 名发育迟缓的弱智组成的紧密团结的社区，他们没有钱，生活中也没有任何有趣的事情发生。制造产品根本与技术无关。

>>109588058

>dumping 700k on marketing

>在营销上倾销70万

That's not as bad of an investment as you might think.

这并不像您想象的那么糟糕的投资。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787070224723737.png

>>109588034

you are conflating most active users being shitposters with most people are shitposters. Majority doesnt actively post.

您将大多数活跃用户都是垃圾海报与大多数人都是垃圾海报混为一谈。大多数人不主动发帖。

Its the same shit as twitter 80% of posts is only 20% of its users.

这和 Twitter 一样，80% 的帖子只代表 20% 的用户。

>>109588058

This is what I hate about society, anon. Fucking capitalism.

这就是我对社会的厌恶，匿名。该死的资本主义。

Money was a mistake.

金钱是一个错误。

Monetizing websites was a mistake.

通过网站获利是一个错误。

I hate websites that make profit.

我讨厌那些营利的网站。

>>109588070

The majority of active, inactive, shitposters and non-shitposters use Discord as a real-time communication service

大多数活跃的、不活跃的、垃圾帖子者和非垃圾帖子者都使用 Discord 作为实时通信服务

>>109588076

You are a child

你是个孩子

>>109587979

doesn't seem organic right

似乎不有机的权利

>>109588082

wrong

>>109587911

>This is the biggest bunch of "Will never achieve anything" advice I've ever read

>这是我读过的最大的一堆“永远不会取得任何成就”的建议

And why is that?

这是为什么呢？

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787070421073321.png

>>109588020

Indeed

Ideally I would love a discord clone in an easy to deploy container to host on my own VPS, even paying for a cloudflare TURN server the costs for streaming video would be way less than how much people in my discord server pay for nitro.

理想情况下，我希望在一个易于部署的容器中使用一个 Discord 克隆来托管在我自己的 VPS 上，即使支付 Cloudflare TURN 服务器的费用，流媒体视频的成本也将远远低于我的 Discord 服务器中的人们为 nitro 支付的费用。

But discord has been around for 10 years and all the alternatives are still shit

但不和谐已经存在了 10 年，所有的替代方案仍然很糟糕

>>109588085

There's nothing childish about hating capitalism or money. That's a hallmark of maturity. Wanting to do something about those 2 problems (Capitalism and money) makes you courageous.

憎恨资本主义或金钱并不幼稚。这是成熟的标志。想要解决这两个问题（资本主义和金钱）会让你变得勇敢。

We as human beings can absolutely find a way to make a more fair and equitable society, and we can move beyond the need of money as a society. That is the great filter that we will overcome.

作为人类，我们绝对可以找到一种方法来建立一个更加公平和公正的社会，并且我们可以超越社会对金钱的需求。这就是我们将要克服的伟大过滤器。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787070556629376.jpg

>>109588087

No, that's correct, that's the overwhelming majority of Discord use

不，这是正确的，这是 Discord 的绝大多数使用情况

I assume you're just a guy with no friends who pops into Discords to get information and because you lack theory of mind you think that's what everyone uses Discord for, but that's not the case

我假设你只是一个没有朋友的人，只是为了获取信息而进入 Discord，因为你缺乏心理理论，你认为这就是每个人使用 Discord 的目的，但事实并非如此

>>109588092

Impractical, pie-in-the-sky advice

不切实际、天上掉馅饼的建议

>>109588103

>There's nothing childish about hating capitalism or money.

>憎恨资本主义或金钱并不幼稚。

Yes there is

是的，有

It's basically I can't understand the practicalities of the world, I want everything handed to me like when I was a kid, I don't want to have to get along and comprimise with other human beings I should just get everything I want

基本上是我无法理解世界的实际情况，我想要一切都像小时候一样交给我，我不想与其他人相处和妥协我应该得到我想要的一切

>>109588102

there are literal discord clones on github made as portfolio projects.

github 上有一些作为组合项目制作的不和谐克隆。

>>109588104

all your friends are here

你所有的朋友都在这里

>>109588112

https://theslowburningfuse.wordpress.com/2024/11/20/capitalism-and-the-childish-idea-of-no-such-thing-as-too-much/

Lets try and keep it on the topic of FOSS/Technology however.

不过，让我们尝试将其保留在 FOSS/技术的主题上。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787070724214462.png

>>109585927

Here's a cool thing about making something: you make it so you can use it, and if it's good, other people might want to use it too. Otherwise you're doing something called "making a new product" and you have do a thing called "marketing".

制作东西有一个很酷的事情：你制作它，以便你可以使用它，如果它好，其他人可能也想使用它。 否则，你正在做一件叫做“制造新产品”的事情，并且你已经做了一件叫做“营销”的事情。

>>109588104

friends use voicecom not text

朋友使用语音通信而不是文本

you exposing your own miserable existence

你暴露了自己悲惨的存在

>>109588114

yeah and every single one I've tried is dogshit

是的，我尝试过的每一个都是狗屎

Anon dont listen to them, I will tell you the truth. The problem lies in society not tech. A person with good life. Having healthy relationship with friends and family and having a good job will never use a fucking social media in the first place. It is a space for retards and schizos. I know its a hard to swallow pill but there was a reason why people made fun of nerds in the past. Socially disabled people that escaped to internet, that's what they/we are.

别听他们的，我会告诉你真相。问题在于社会而不是技术。一个拥有美好生活的人。与朋友和家人建立健康的关系并拥有一份好工作永远不会首先使用该死的社交媒体。这是一个为智障和精神分裂者提供的空间。我知道这是一种难以下咽的药丸，但过去人们取笑书呆子是有原因的。逃到互联网上的社交障碍人士，这就是他们/我们。

>>109588131

Discord has voicecom you fucking idiot

Discord 有 Voicecom 你他妈的白痴

>>109588127

If he said "capitalism is bad" he might have a point, depending on what he means by captialism

如果他说“资本主义不好”，他可能有道理，这取决于他所说的资本主义的含义

"money is bad" is extremely childish

“钱不好”是极其幼稚的

>>109588134

If it has chat and video calls its good enough. Do you need more meme emotes or what?

如果有聊天和视频通话就足够了。您需要更多模因表情还是什么？

>>109588147

Money is bad because it gamifies literally everything at scale. It's that simple.

金钱是不好的，因为它可以大规模地游戏化一切。就是这么简单。

>>109588141

the conversation was about shitposting you fucking illiterate.

谈话内容是在骂你这个该死的文盲。

>>109588154

you're going to have to qualify "gamifies" and say why that's bad

你必须限定“游戏化”并说明为什么这不好

>>109588165

No it wasn't

不，不是的

>>109588085

You think you're so adult for accepting and adapting to shit?

你以为你已经成熟到可以接受和适应狗屎了吗？

>>109588151

>we have chat and video calls at home

>我们在家聊天和视频通话

>

bruh

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787071078983565.jpg

>>109588168

Easy. See Goodhart's law.

简单的。参见古德哈特定律。

Gamifies, as an gamified metrics.

游戏化，作为游戏化的指标。

Money treats society like it is a game, and it intrinsically motivates people to step on others. It leads to bad outcomes.

金钱把社会当作一场游戏，它从本质上激励人们踩别人的脚。它会导致不好的结果。

I am not very religious personally, but I like this quote from the NIV:

我个人不是很虔诚，但我喜欢 NIV 中的这句话：

"For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs."

“因为贪财是万恶之源。有些人贪图金钱，就背离了信仰，被许多悲伤刺痛。”

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787071127540762.png

>>109588187

Adapting to difficult practical realities is part of becoming an adult, yeah

适应困难的现实现实是成为成年人的一部分，是的

>>109588168

Not him, but humans evolved to live in tribal societies and they inherently dont need money because the tribe is self-sustaining and creates everything that it needs

不是他，而是人类进化到生活在部落社会中，他们本质上不需要金钱，因为部落是自给自足的，并创造了它需要的一切

Money came in when some asshole wanted to gain power over other human beings.

当一些混蛋想要获得凌驾于其他人之上的权力时，金钱就出现了。

>>109588195

>Money treats society like it is a game

>金钱对待社会就像对待一场游戏

No it doesn't

不，没那么严重

Money is just a way of making trading easier, and trade is good for society

金钱只是让交易变得更容易的一种方式，而贸易对社会有好处

You can play games with money sure but you can play games with anything

你可以用钱玩游戏，但你可以用任何东西玩游戏

>>109588188

>Do you need more meme emotes or what?

>您需要更多模因表情还是什么？

Answer the damn question if you gonna respond. What the fuck do you even need?

如果你愿意回应，就回答这个该死的问题。你到底还需要什么？

Like the main functionality is voice com with occasionally posting funny memes, thats it.

就像主要功能是语音通信，偶尔发布有趣的模因，就是这样。

>>109588205

>trade is good for society

>贸易对社会有益

Can we at least agree that lending money with interest should be banned?

我们至少可以同意禁止带利息借贷吗？

>>109588204

>Not him, but humans evolved to live in tribal societies

>不是他，而是人类进化到生活在部落社会中

Yeah then they evolved to live in civilizations

是的，然后他们进化到生活在文明中

>>109588108

>make new things by taking inspiration from things outside the industry standard?

>从行业标准之外的事物中获取灵感来创造新事物？

>that's impractical pie in the sky advice

>这是不切实际的天上掉馅饼的建议

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787071274034906.png

>>109588206

You are a nigger not worth responding to with any effort.

你是个黑鬼，不值得付出任何努力。

>NOOOO IT'S GOOD JUST ANSWER A QUESTION NO ONE ASKED BRO

>>109588209

It can be, it's a complicated issue

可能是这样，这是一个复杂的问题

>>109588213

What new things are you going to accomplish if you use a non-ALGOL language? It literally doesn't matter what language you use

如果使用非 ALGOL 语言，您将完成哪些新事情？使用什么语言实际上并不重要

>>109588215

>i have no response and i must SCREECH

>我没有回应，我必须尖叫

low iq monkey

智商低的猴子

seeing how the thread is going seems we have a discord defense force here

看看话题进展如何，看来我们这里有一支不和谐的防御力量

>>109588209

No. If someone wants to offer a loan with interest that's not for the government to ban.

不可以。如果有人想提供带息贷款，政府不会禁止。

>>109588205

>Money is just a way of making trading easier, and trade is good for society

>金钱只是让交易变得更容易的一种方式，而贸易对社会有好处

In a fully automated society there will be no need for money. There will be enough for everyone and nobody will have too much.

在一个完全自动化的社会中，将不需要金钱。每个人都会有足够的东西，而且没有人会拥有太多。

>>109588204

Money is an abstraction of trade, and in tribal societies people like you would've been thrown off a cliff or let get eaten by a bear once it was clear you weren't pulling your weight. I don't know why you're nostalgia to a much more cruel system when you'd be the first to be culled when your default behavior is doomposting from the house your mother pays for.

金钱是贸易的抽象概念，在部落社会中，一旦发现你没有尽力而为，像你这样的人就会被扔下悬崖，或者被熊吃掉。 我不知道为什么你会怀念一个更加残酷的制度，因为你是第一个被淘汰的人，而你的默认行为是从你母亲付钱买的房子里发出厄运。

>>109587900

>You made a thread entitled "the difficulty of making something new," and instead talked about reimplementing things which already exist

>您创建了一个题为“创造新事物的困难”的主题，并讨论了重新实现已经存在的事物

Exactly.

It's seems like "rewrite it but free" and "rewrite it but in Rust" is the extreme of what programmers consider innovation this days, it says a lot about how the field fell compared to the past.

似乎“重写它但免费”和“重写它但用 Rust”是当今程序员所认为的创新的极端，它充分说明了该领域与过去相比如何衰落。

>advices

My advice is more general, more like a methodology, first you should identify what are basic blocks of computing, things like data structures and algorithms or certain composite technologies, this is a matter of opinion and taste so I resist giving a list here, then all other composite technologies you should question regularly even what you and everyone else takes for granted, and here I include also things like programming languages, operating systems, conventions, standards, anything that is or is part of a platform, then you identity a problem you want to solve, doesn't have to be a new problem, even a problem that everyone considers to be solved might be solved in a better way, then starting from you set of basic blocks you approach the problem.

我的建议更笼统，更像是一种方法论，首先你应该确定什么是基本计算块，比如数据结构和算法或某些复合技术，这是一个观点和品味的问题，所以我拒绝在这里列出清单，然后你应该定期质疑所有其他复合技术，甚至你和其他人认为理所当然的东西，在这里我还包括诸如编程语言，操作系统，约定，标准，任何属于平台的东西，然后你确定一个你想要解决的问题，不一定是一个新问题，甚至每个人都认为可以解决的问题可能会以更好的方式解决，然后从您的一组基本块开始解决问题。

This is an opposite approach to what most programmers do this day, which is bulding on top of very opinionated platforms, importing as much stuff you can from even more opinionated libraries and then try to solve the problem on top of that.

这与当今大多数程序员所做的方法相反，即建立在非常固执己见的平台之上，从更加固执己见的库中导入尽可能多的东西，然后尝试在此基础上解决问题。

How can you build anything really new when you restrict the space of possibilities to basically what other people the ones that built the platforms and the libraries wanted? We already know the outcome.

当你将可能性的空间限制在基本上是其他人（构建平台和库的人）想要的东西时，你如何能够构建任何真正新的东西？我们已经知道结果了。

Systems like Doug Engelbart's oN-Line System which you mentioned were done completely from scratch, they even built their own hardware! Hardware is another real limitation to innovation, it's all so standardized which might seem good, but the problem is that it's standardized for the interests of few corporations, that itself limits the space of possibilities even before you start writing a single line of code.

像您提到的Doug Engelbart 的在线系统这样的系统完全是从头开始完成的，他们甚至构建了自己的硬件！硬件是创新的另一个真正的限制，它都是如此标准化，这看起来不错，但问题是它是为了少数公司的利益而标准化的，这本身就限制了可能性的空间，甚至在你开始编写一行代码之前。

>>109588253

>In a fully automated society there will be no need for money. There will be enough for everyone and nobody will have too much.

>在一个完全自动化的社会中，将不需要金钱。每个人都会有足够的东西，而且没有人会拥有太多。

That society doesn't exist

那个社会不存在

>>109588273

You're right, but it can exist, and it should, and I'm working towards making it a reality.

你是对的，但它可以存在，而且应该存在，我正在努力使其成为现实。

>>109588243

>obsessed with emotes

>沉迷于表情

>calls others low iq monkeys

>称别人为低智商猴子

>>109588253

Wrong because you are denying the human genetic trait to want more. And not only want more, but need other people to have less. You live in a complete fantasy land that completely ignores the human condition.

错误是因为你否认了人类想要更多的基因特征。 不仅想要更多，还需要别人拥有更少。 你生活在一个完全无视人类状况的完全幻想的土地上。

Guys, should I make a social media where the server costs are paid for by the users on Patreon?

伙计们，我应该创建一个由 Patreon 上的用户支付服务器费用的社交媒体吗？

People donate so much money to youtubers, artists etc.

人们向 YouTube 用户、艺术家等捐赠了很多钱。

Why not a new website?

为什么不建立一个新网站呢？

>what's the point?

> 有什么意义？

Isnt it obvious? This means it's run by and owned by the users, not some greedy corporation. The immediate benefit is NO FUCKING ADS, no behavioral data collection, and no bullshit of any kind.

这不是很明显吗？这意味着它是由用户而不是某个贪婪的公司运营和拥有的。直接的好处是没有该死的广告，没有行为数据收集，也没有任何类型的废话。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787071752009793.jpg

>>109588253

You are for it cause you dont understand how things work. Take housing crisis, you save for a house, bank can lend 10x your savings to other people to buy homes they cant afford. House price goes up and you are forced into a loan to afford a home. Now both the poor bastards and you are paying the bank money to get a home. They default because they cant really afford it and you pay even more financing the loss. GG you got double scammed.

你之所以支持它，是因为你不明白事情是如何运作的。以住房危机为例，你存钱买房子，银行可以把你存款的10倍借给其他人，让他们买他们买不起的房子。房价上涨，您被迫贷款买房。现在，这些可怜的混蛋和你都在向银行付钱才能买房。他们违约是因为他们真的无力承担，而你需要支付更多的费用来弥补损失。 GG你被双重骗了。

>>109588287

You are escalating to borderline insults. I am now going to ask you to return to civility and provide any evidence for this so-called "human genetic trait to want more" -- can you please provide any evidence to support such a genetic trait? Who gave you the authority to define what the human condition is?

你正在升级到边缘侮辱。我现在请你回到客气点，为这种所谓的“想要更多的人类遗传特征”提供任何证据——你能提供任何证据来支持这种遗传特征吗？谁赋予你定义人类状况的权力？

>>109588283

>I'm working towards making it a reality.

>我正在努力使其成为现实。

how?

>>109588298

By contributing to FOSS and democratic socialism.

通过为自由和开源软件和民主社会主义做出贡献。

>>109588286

>he asked me if i want emotes

>他问我是否想要表情

>this means he wants emotes

>这意味着他想要表情

holy shit you are genuine stupid

天啊你真是个傻子

>>109588297

>I'm just going to ignore the attributes of every civilization throughout history, let alone the modern examples of socialist countries vs capitalist countries, all of which devolve into castes and hierachies

>我只是要忽略历史上每个文明的属性，更不用说社会主义国家与资本主义国家的现代例子，所有这些都退化为种姓和等级制度

Lay off the drugs.

戒掉毒品吧

>>109588253

>No. If someone wants to offer a loan with interest that's not for the government to ban.

>不。如果有人想提供带息贷款，政府不会禁止。

The problem is that those with money will manipulate the less fortunate into taking loans they can never pay back.

问题在于，那些有钱人会操纵那些不幸的人接受他们永远无法偿还的贷款。

Do you think people WANT 60-year payment plants?

您认为人们想要 60 年的付款机制吗？

>>109588312

Who are you quoting?

你在引用谁的话？

>>109588303

Oh so you're a fucking retard

哦，原来你是个该死的弱智

You can't FORCE society to become a communist utopia, it will only reach that point if resources become so abundant that it's not neccessary

你不能强迫社会成为一个共产主义乌托邦，只有当资源变得如此丰富而没有必要时，它才会达到这一点

Society isn't anywhere close to that right now

现在的社会还远未达到这一点

>>109588303

What happens when someone does more work and someone does less work and the person who does less work wants half the reward?

当一个人做更多的工作，另一个人做更少的工作，并且做更少工作的人想要一半的奖励时，会发生什么？

>>109588307

being obsessed with emotes doesn't necessarily mean you want emotes

痴迷于表情并不一定意味着你想要表情

you're just obsessed with them

你只是沉迷于他们

>I ASKED YOU ABOUT EMOTES

>ANSWER MY QUESTION ABOUT EMOTES

>THESE LOW IQ MONKEYS WONT EVEN TALK ABOUT EMOTES

>>109588330

Leftists will always lose because they play stupid when they know they're losing an argument. Good luck getting your band of downtrodden misfits together to overthrow the system. Those are definitely the people you can trust to do hard work lmao.

左派总是会失败，因为当他们知道自己正在输掉一场争论时，他们就会表现得愚蠢。 祝你好运，让你那群受压迫的、格格不入的人团结起来推翻这个制度。 这些绝对是你可以信任的人，他们会努力工作，lmao。

>>109588337

You got the ESL issue, it was an example for "what feature do you want"

您遇到了 ESL 问题，这是“您想要什么功能”的示例

>>109588331

I'm not an authoritarian, no.

我不是独裁者，不是。

>>109588353

Go to >>>/pol/ moron

转到 >>>/pol/ 白痴

>>109588337

Stop screaming, and who are you quoting?

别再尖叫了，你在引用谁的话？

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787072238929566.jpg

>>109588371

>I'm not an authoritarian

>我不是独裁者

FOSS is authoritarian and seeks to supplant paid software by force

自由和开源软件是专制的，并试图通过武力取代付费软件

>>109588354

I want actually good ux and actually good voice/video/screen sharing

我想要真正好的用户体验和真正好的语音/视频/屏幕共享

not the dogshit that you call good enough

不是你所说的足够好的狗屎

>>109588380

How can you consider FOSS to be authoritarian? There are many FOSS licenses. Some have more requirements than others. The AGPL mandates freedom. It forces freedom.

你怎么能认为自由和开源软件是专制的呢？有许多自由和开源软件许可证。有些人比其他人有更多的要求。 AGPL 强制要求自由。它迫使自由。

>>109588395

>It forces freedom.

>它迫使自由。

you answered your own question

你回答了你自己的问题

>>109588371

>I'm not an authoritarian, no.

>我不是独裁者，不是。

Okay, why are people going to voluntarily use your products?

好吧，为什么人们会自愿使用你的产品？

>Go to >>>/pol/ moron

>转到>>>/pol/白痴

You brought pol here.

你把波尔带到这里来了。

>>109588398

I see through your lies.

我看穿了你的谎言。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787072429216706.jpg

>>109587762

It's really simple anon. The internet was a separate place. Remember "surfing the web"? Just the act of being online was in and of itself a defined hobby.

这真的很简单。互联网是一个独立的地方。还记得“网上冲浪”吗？上网行为本身就是一种明确的爱好。

The userbase was different as well. There was variation, but by definition they were more tech literate than the people that weren't on the internet. A smaller userbase also made it easier to have some shared "internet culture" across the majority of sites. Remember YouTube Rewind? It's pointless to have one now; everyone's youtube is different. (yes, youtube is not exactly "old internet", but I hope you see my point)

用户群也不同。虽然存在差异，但根据定义，他们比不上网的人更懂技术。较小的用户群也使得大多数网站更容易拥有一些共享的“互联网文化”。还记得YouTube倒带吗？现在拥有一个已经毫无意义了；每个人的 youtube 都不一样。 （是的，youtube 并不完全是“旧互联网”，但我希望你明白我的观点）

There was also an emphasis on leaving your personal touch. Create your own site, your own flash game. Compare geocities, forum signatures and customized myspace profiles with today's options: a few words plus emojis on your "bio". This is even evident in youtube's old slogan: broadcast *yourself*.

还强调留下您的个人风格。创建您自己的网站、您自己的 Flash 游戏。将地理城市、论坛签名和定制的 myspace 个人资料与当今的选项进行比较：在您的“个人简介”上添加几个单词和表情符号。这甚至在 YouTube 的老口号中也很明显：广播*自己*。

>>109588406

ownership is not "intolerance"

所有权并非“不宽容”

the GPL seeks to supplant ownership of software by force

GPL 寻求以武力取代软件所有权

this is a bad idea, because ownership of software can result in good things

这是一个坏主意，因为软件的所有权可以带来好处

non-ownership of software can also result in good things, but assuming no software should be owned is just retarded extremism

不拥有软件也可以带来好事，但假设不应该拥有软件只是弱智的极端主义

>>109588395

Paid always wins because the money motivation makes people work harder, and not only that, work on features that are desirable to customers and not person pet features or obtuse philosophy of the developer. Very rarely does FOSS align with users.

付费总是获胜，因为金钱动机使人们更加努力地工作，不仅如此，开发客户想要的功能，而不是个人喜欢的功能或开发人员的迟钝理念。 自由和开放源码软件很少与用户保持一致。

>>109588410

>Just the act of being online was in and of itself a defined hobby.

>上网行为本身就是一种明确的爱好。

no it wasnt you dumb zoomer

不，这不是你愚蠢的缩放器

>>109586868

>>109587299

i care about this shit. dearly in fact

我关心这个狗屎。事实上，亲爱的

>>109588431

you're nobody

你什么都不是

you're the <1% with a mental illness

您是<1% 患有精神疾病的人

>>109588354

>e-e-e-esl!

You illiterate nigger he already told you.

你这个不识字的黑鬼他已经告诉过你了。

>>109588429

it's kind of a hyperbole but it's more truth than lie, which is why no one talks about "surfing" today.

这有点夸张，但事实胜于谎言，这就是为什么今天没有人谈论“冲浪”。

>>109588410

>Create your own site, your own flash game. Compare geocities, forum signatures and customized myspace profiles with today's options: a few words plus emojis on your "bio".

>创建您自己的网站、您自己的 Flash 游戏。将地理城市、论坛签名和定制的 myspace 个人资料与当今的选项进行比较：在您的“个人简介”上添加几个单词和表情符号。

Ah fuck I just remembered

啊操我才想起来

You made me depressed, anon.

你让我沮丧了，安恩。

We've sunken SO LOW.

我们已经沉得太低了。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787072693344657.png

>>109588410

"surfing the web" is a fabricated concept by Hollywood and TV shows by people who didn't even understand the internet so this was their pea-brained way to describe something they don't understand, the "hobby" of using the internet has not changed

“网上冲浪”是好莱坞和电视节目中那些根本不懂互联网的人捏造的概念，所以这是他们用豌豆脑子来描述他们不懂的东西，使用互联网的“爱好”并没有改变

>>109588449

that was what people who didn't actually use the internet said about the internet

这就是那些没有真正使用过互联网的人对互联网的评价

"surfing the web" was interesting for about 5 minutes

“网上冲浪”很有趣，大约5分钟

>>109588406

the paradox is fake.

这个悖论是假的。

It relies on people equating speech to violence. And its most used by people using violence to censor speech. They users are the intolerant ones.

它依赖于人们将言论等同于暴力。人们最常使用它来使用暴力来审查言论。他们的用户是不宽容的。

>>109588459

Speech can be violent. This is established fact.

言语可能很暴力。这是既定的事实。

Source: Harvard

资料来源：哈佛大​​学

https://clbb.mgh.harvard.edu/when-is-speech-violence/

>>109588382

from what ive seen its blatant copypaste, its impossible to be worse when its identical.

从我所看到的明目张胆的复制粘贴来看，当它完全相同时，它不可能更糟。

>>109587762

I agree. Collaboration was just assumed on the Internet, or else why would you use it? Entertainment that did exist online was amateurish and could be produced by someone with minimal talent (see superstars from 2004 like LegendaryFrog and Egoraptor). I think one of the issues is that the demographic of the Internet is not what it used to be. Example, the third world (your "friend" who suggested you market to them was trying to sabotage you), and turbo-normies who were afraid to leave MySpace and Facebook back then are now for some reason living on the same platforms as us, reacting with insane vitriol to your suggestion that you leave them. I think we just have to be an example for likeminded people.

我同意。协作只是在互联网上假设的，否则你为什么要使用它？网上确实存在的娱乐内容都是业余的，并且可以由才华横溢的人制作（参见 2004 年的超级巨星，如 LegendaryFrog 和 Egoraptor）。我认为问题之一是互联网的人口结构与过去不同。例如，第三世界（建议你向他们推销的“朋友”试图破坏你），以及当时不敢离开 MySpace 和 Facebook 的涡轮规范，现在由于某种原因与我们生活在同一平台上，对你离开他们的建议做出疯狂的尖酸刻薄的反应。我认为我们只需要成为志同道合的人的榜样。

>>109588020

>Retards just want discord i.e. video, chat, file sharing with zero hassle and costs then even bigger retards come along to screech how IRC/XMPP/etc is totally the same and just run a bouncer bro, just run jitsi bro, just..

>弱智者只是想要不和谐，即零麻烦和零成本的视频、聊天、文件共享，然后更大的弱智者就会尖叫着IRC/XMPP/等是如何完全相同的，只需运行一个保镖兄弟，只需运行jitsi兄弟，就......

We already had /thread almost an hour ago. Everything after was literally just proving this post right.

大约一个小时前我们已经有了 /thread 。之后的一切实际上只是证明这篇文章是正确的。

>>109588468

>they copied the layout so im sure it functions the same

>他们复制了布局，所以我确信它的功能是一样的

>>109587996

They could leave discord anytime. Many alternatives have discord bridges. Revealed preference at work.

他们随时都可以留下不和。许多替代方案都有不和谐的桥梁。在工作中表现出偏好。

>>109588450

I find it hilarious you basically just posted

我觉得你基本上刚刚发布的很搞笑

> Social networks (STILL EXIST)

> 社交网络（仍然存在）

> File sharing (Emule still exists, people Torrent now)

> 文件共享（Emule 仍然存在，人们现在可以下载 Torrent）

> Chatting (Messenger is just Discord)

> 聊天（Messenger 只是 Discord）

> Newgrounds (Called itch.io)

> Newgrounds（称为 itch.io）

> All Your Base (Youtube)

> 所有你的基地 (Youtube)

It's absolutely wonderful people complain about an internet that they never use even though it still exists today. It seems to me what you actually do as a hobby is complain.

人们抱怨他们从未使用过的互联网，尽管它今天仍然存在，这绝对是一件好事。 在我看来，你实际上的爱好就是抱怨。

>>109588496

They didn't even copy the layout they just use the same standard UI boilerplate graphics literally everyone does. Copying implies a base amount of effort that simply isn't there.

他们甚至没有复制布局，只是使用与每个人相同的标准 UI 样板图形。复制意味着根本不存在的基本努力。

>>109588501

They have this romanticized idea of the old Internet where browsing people's shitty Geocities websites was some sort of fulfilling activity forever lost to time

他们对旧互联网有一种浪漫化的想法，浏览人们糟糕的 Geocities 网站是一种永远迷失在时间中的满足感活动

>>109588496

i replied to >i want good ux

我回复>我想要良好的用户体验

>>109588010

>That represents a small minority use of forums

>这代表了少数人使用论坛

I would say it's like 99% of technical topic forums, where technical ranges from computers and biology to tcg and more.

我想说这就像 99% 的技术主题论坛，技术范围从计算机、生物学到 tcg 等等。

>>109588517

Most forum use centres around big forums that basically move at real-time speeds

大多数论坛的使用都集中在基本上以实时速度移动的大型论坛上

>>109588514

>doesn't understand the difference between UI and UX

>不理解UI和UX之间的区别

>thinks his opinions matter

>认为他的意见很重要

>>109588514

UI is not UX

用户界面不是用户体验

>>109588456

>>109588458

Ok, maybe I didn't describe it well enough. What I mean was, at least there was an internet to explore: specialized forums, tight-knit communities and blogs/personal pages. Now it's all discord, reddit and algorithm slop

好吧，也许是我描述得不够好。我的意思是，至少有一个互联网可供探索：专门的论坛、紧密结合的社区和博客/个人页面。现在全是不和谐、reddit 和算法失误

>>109588545

Now you can explore discord and reddit

现在您可以探索discord 和reddit

What's the difference

有什么区别

>>109588467

their argument basically is

他们的论点基本上是

>i can stress over speech

>我可以通过言语强调

>stress causes physical harm

>压力会造成身体伤害

>this means offensive stuff is violence to me

>这意味着攻击性的东西对我来说就是暴力

if you follow that logic then you can murder anyone in self defense just because you are easily offended included the people censoring speech because that causes stress to you just the same.

如果你遵循这种逻辑，那么你可以仅仅因为你很容易被冒犯而出于自卫而谋杀任何人，包括那些审查言论的人，因为这同样会给你带来压力。

>>109588431

I'm actually making a "shitty FOSS website nobody gives a shit about".

我实际上正在制作一个“没人关心的糟糕的自由开源网站”。

Check it out

一探究竟

https://minisome.dy.fi

I've spent countless months writing it in notepad. Didn't want to use bloated React let alone AI.

我花了无数个月在记事本上写它。不想使用臃肿的 React，更不用说 AI。

I'm looking for people to join the project. You can either code, test the site or simply give advice.

我正在寻找人员加入该项目。您可以编码、测试网站或只是提供建议。

It probably won't save the world but at least there's nobody making any money from you posting on there.

它可能不会拯救世界，但至少没有人从你在那里发帖赚钱。

I made the site because it pisses me off how everything's monetized. Just me posting on 4chan indirectly benefits the shareholders of 4chan inc because this site is an empty sandbox where the money comes from the users posting posts on it.

我创建这个网站是因为它让我对所有东西的货币化方式感到愤怒。仅我在 4chan 上发帖就间接使 4chan 公司的股东受益，因为这个网站是一个空沙箱，钱来自在其上发帖的用户。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787073351802107.gif

>>109588509

It's funny, the modern Geocities experience is making a 1 view Youtube channel with low quality content. Geocities was only a means of expression and the people who made Geocities pages now make Tiktoks no one watches. It's just hilarious because it's more accessible than ever to make your own web page and have 5 views, yet they never do it, because what has fundamentally changed is everyone is grifting for a million dollars and can't be bothered to just express themselves because they can.

有趣的是，现代的 Geocities 体验正在制作一个低质量内容的 1 次观看 Youtube 频道。 Geocities 只是一种表达方式，而制作 Geocities 页面的人现在让 Tiktoks 无人关注。 这很搞笑，因为现在比以往任何时候都更容易制作自己的网页并拥有 5 个浏览量，但他们却从未这样做，因为从根本上改变的是每个人都在骗取一百万美元，并且懒得去表达自己，因为他们可以。

>>109588292

A lot of forums already operate this way. Not patreon but straight donations (so no 30% cut for patreon).

很多论坛已经以这种方式运作。不是 patreon 而是直接捐赠（所以 patreon 没有 30% 的折扣）。

The problem is the same as was very clearly articulated by a few anons before though: nobody will join if you don't give anyone a reason to join.

问题与之前一些匿名者非常清楚地阐明的问题相同：如果你不给任何人加入的理由，没有人会加入。

>>109588437

it's fine if you think that. i actually enjoy using machines and don't feel the need to "update" them every 3 years over "advances" that are not even real. for example, adobe have added basically zero new features to photoshop in 10 years, but the system requirements to run it have markedly increased because they have turned it into an always-online spyware machine that needs to extort money from you on a monthly basis. I do not think resisting this makes me "mentally ill". I think you are simply a person who wants to consume children's media all day and will pay any cost and produce infinite waste to make that happen.

如果你这么想就好了。我实际上很喜欢使用机器，并且不觉得有必要每三年“更新”一次它们，甚至不存在任何“进步”。例如，adobe在10年里为photoshop添加的新功能基本上为零，但运行它的系统要求却明显增加，因为他们把它变成了一个永远在线的间谍软件机器，需要每月向你勒索钱财。我不认为抵制这一点会让我“精神病”。我认为你只是一个想要整天消费儿童媒体的人，并且愿意为此付出任何代价并产生无限的浪费。

>>109588567

I don't update either, that doesn't make me a freetard

我也不更新，这并不意味着我是一个自由者

>>109588562

>>109588509

If you think Geocities and Tiktok are the same, you weren't there.

如果您认为 Geocities 和 Tiktok 是一样的，那么您就不在那儿。

Back in the day websites had SOVL

以前网站上有 SOVL

They werent enshittified to the max.

他们并没有达到极限。

That's exactly the reason why you are posting on 4chan right now. 4chan is a living fossil, stuck in 2008 or whatever

这正是您现在在 4chan 上发帖的原因。 4chan 是活化石，停留在 2008 年或其他什么时候

That's why you like this site. It's less shit than Tiktok

这就是您喜欢这个网站的原因。比抖音还垃圾

>>109588567

You have the mature position.

你有成熟的立场。

>>109588577

>Back in the day websites had SOVL

> 过去网站上有 SOVL

They were entertaining for about 5 minutes

他们娱乐了大约5分钟

Less entertaining than some Youtube channel with 23 subscribers

不如某些拥有 23 名订阅者的 Youtube 频道那么有趣

>>109588501

Come on, itch.io is far worse than newgrounds et al. were. Social networks have been all fucked up and you know it. Nobody does emule, but yes, torrents are healthier than ever.

拜托，itch.io 比 newgrounds 等人差远了。是。社交网络已经一团糟了，你知道的。没有人使用 emule，但是，Torrent 比以往任何时候都更健康。

There have been no meme-quality OC created in over 15 years anywhere, least of all 4cuck now. And youtube is trash that make youtube poops of yesteryear look like fine art.

超过 15 年以来，任何地方都没有创造出具有模因品质的 OC，尤其是现在的 4cuck。 YouTube 是垃圾，让过去的 YouTube 粪便看起来像艺术品。

>>109588545

Websites still exist, you just don't care to look. And if you cared that much, you'd make a modern dmoz. You act like people were just clicking links from site to site back in the day browsing 100+ websites per day, they weren't. There is no inherent value to browsing unique domains vs unique pages on Reddit.

网站仍然存在，只是你不屑去查看。 如果你这么在乎，你就会制作一个现代的 dmoz。 你表现得就像人们每天浏览 100 多个网站一样，只是点击从一个网站到另一个网站的链接，但事实并非如此。 在 Reddit 上浏览独特的域名和独特的页面并没有内在的价值。

>>109588526

Those are social forums and not technical topic forums, though.

不过，这些是社交论坛，而不是技术主题论坛。

>>109588596

So?

>>109588599

Glad you agree.

很高兴你同意。

>>109588567

>adobe have added basically zero new features to photoshop in 10 years, but the system requirements to run it have markedly increased because they have turned it into an always-online spyware machine that needs to extort money from you on a monthly basis

>adobe在10年里为photoshop添加的新功能基本上为零，但运行它的系统要求却明显增加，因为他们把它变成了一个永远在线的间谍软件机器，需要每月向你勒索钱财

This is a massive problem.

这是一个大问题。

The world is drowning in e-waste because companies are forcing us to upgrade our devices only so the latest spyware would work.

世界正被电子垃圾淹没，因为公司迫使我们升级我们的设备，以便最新的间谍软件能够发挥作用。

That's why I'm going to guarantee that my app runs on any device even 20 years old.

这就是为什么我要保证我的应用程序可以在任何设备上运行，即使是 20 年前的设备。

>>109588577

I was there, you fucking faggot. I was playing games online on a modem, before every fucking game was someone trying to be an esports legend, back when you do something online and not have to deal with retarded normies (you) and tryhards. I grew up playing games like ZZT and MUDs in the terminal, I fucking had my own Geocities page. You don't know fucking anything about the internet you fucking theater kid poser.

我当时就在场，你这个该死的混蛋。 我在调制解调器上在线玩游戏，在每场他妈的游戏都是有人试图成为电子竞技传奇之前，当你在网上做一些事情而不必与弱智的正常人（你）和努力者打交道时。 我从小就在终端上玩 ZZT 和 MUD 之类的游戏，我他妈有自己的 Geocities 页面。 你他妈的对互联网一无所知，你这个他妈的剧院孩子装腔作势。

>>109588587

okay lmao contrarian

好吧 lmao 逆向思维

I get it, you're pining over your rose tinted glasses and in 20 years you'll be pining about Discord and Reddit.

我明白了，你正怀念着你的玫瑰色眼镜，20 年后你将会怀念 Discord 和 Reddit。

>'member when you could post funny 5 second memes on TikTok, now everyone uses GlipGlorp and it's not anything like TikTok.

>'成员们，当你可以在 TikTok 上发布有趣的 5 秒模因时，现在每个人都使用 GlipGlorp，而且它与 TikTok 完全不同。

>>109588557

>>109588591

reddit fucking sucks as a forum substitute. After a post has been up for a couple hours (or days for smaller subs) no one visits it any more. And after the first comments, a considerable amount of traffic is two people engaging on 1-on-1 conversations. On forums, posts live for longer and even if the discussion in the replies takes a deep turn, people can still join in (compared to reddit where they're hidden).

作为论坛的替代品，reddit 真他妈糟糕。帖子发布几个小时（对于较小的订阅者则为几天）后，就没有人再访问它了。在第一条评论之后，相当大的流量是两个人进行一对一的对话。在论坛上，帖子的存在时间更长，即使回复中的讨论发生了深刻的转变，人们仍然可以加入（与隐藏帖子的 Reddit 相比）。

discord I'll admit I haven't tried to use much, especially now that they've implemented threads. However, substituting a forum with a chat is even worse than reddit and I hope there's no need to elaborate on that. As for their threads implementation, I wouldn't be surprised if it suffers from the same problem as reddit: not being long-lived enough, people not joining in at every stage of the discussion.

不和谐 我承认我没有尝试使用太多，特别是现在他们已经实现了线程。然而，用聊天代替论坛比 Reddit 更糟糕，我希望没有必要对此进行详细说明。至于他们的线程实现，如果它遇到与 reddit 相同的问题，我不会感到惊讶：寿命不够长，人们没有参与讨论的每个阶段。

My main gripe with the internet now is not that I can't visit 100 unique sites a day, is that the sweet spot of medium-length communities has vanished.

我现在对互联网的主要抱怨不是我每天无法访问 100 个独特的网站，而是中等长度社区的最佳点已经消失。

>>109586717

Not all the criticism you get is because you're running a website, you fucking faggot.

你收到的所有批评并不是因为你在运营一个网站，你这个该死的基佬。

Look into a mirror for one fucking second and you'll get it, maybe.

照照镜子一秒钟，也许你就会明白。

>>109588587

I use amule - client for the eD2k and Kad networks, like eMule.

我使用 amule - eD2k 和 Kad 网络的客户端，例如 eMule。

>Part of aMule is based on

>aMule的部分基于

>Kademlia: Peer-to-peer routing based on the XOR metric.

>Kademlia：基于 XOR 度量的点对点路由。

>Copyright (c) 2002-2011 Petar Maymounkov (petar@post.harvard.edu)

>版权所有 (c) 2002-2011 Petar Maymounkov (petar@post.harvard.edu)

>http://kademlia.scs.cs.nyu.edu

>>109588051

Woman in pink is a 7/10 cutie. That shitty thing in green looks like that very punchable "friend" nobody likes.

穿粉红色衣服的女人是个 7/10 可爱的人。那个绿色的垃圾东西看起来就像是那个没人喜欢的非常容易被打的“朋友”。

>>109588708

I would rather have pizzacake because she is smart, has green eyes (rare), is funny, not full of herself, and is able to critique herself honestly

我宁愿吃披萨饼，因为她很聪明，有绿眼睛（罕见），很有趣，不自满，并且能够诚实地批评自己

>>109588644

OK zoomer

行吧，小屁孩。

>>109588708

Good taste.

品味不错。

>>109588725

Shit taste.

狗屎的味道。

>>109588223

I said to expose yourself to them, not necessarily to use them, as it's about expanding your awareness of what's out there and different ways of solving problems. If you have some familiarity with SQL, for example, you'll have some idea when a relational database is the right tool for the job, and ideally be able to carry over techniques from database programming when they fit the situation.

我说的是让自己接触它们，不一定要使用它们，因为它是为了扩大你对外面的事物和解决问题的不同方法的认识。例如，如果您对 SQL 有一定的了解，那么您就会知道关系数据库何时是适合该工作的工具，并且理想情况下能够在适合情况时继承数据库编程技术。

>>109588657

theres too many thirdies trying to hustle every site that gives them the chance nowadays. good discussion gets killed to that current thing can get promoted by a spam account to drive up the algo with fake interest to promote whatever scheme they got going on. non algo websites dont have the incentive for them to fake traffic and make it look very active so any traffic is real market demand

现在有太多第三方试图抢占每一个给他们机会的网站。良好的讨论被扼杀了，当前的事情可以通过垃圾邮件帐户来推广，以虚假的兴趣推动算法，以推广他们正在进行的任何计划。非算法网站没有动力伪造流量并使其看起来非常活跃，因此任何流量都是真正的市场需求

>>109588657

Forums still exist. Which again proves how out of touch you are. Forums were never a place you just link browsed into, they were attached to specific topic or game and a specific Subreddit or Discord server is literally the same experience. And here's the real fact, forums suck, did you really think it was a great user experience to post something and then come back in 48 hour and MAYBE have a reply? There's a reason why people migrated, and there's a reason why you're not making your own personal forum right now. The death of the forums was unironically due to people like you, because you stopped going back or rather, many forums died because their topic became untopical.

论坛仍然存在。 这再次证明你是多么脱离现实。 论坛从来都不是您只需链接浏览的地方，它们附加到特定的主题或游戏，并且特定的 Subreddit 或 Discord 服务器实际上具有相同的体验。 事实是，论坛很糟糕，你真的认为发布一些东西然后在 48 小时内回来并可能得到回复是一种很棒的用户体验吗？ 人们迁移是有原因的，也是您现在不创建自己的个人论坛的原因。 具有讽刺意味的是，论坛的消亡是由于像您这样的人造成的，因为您不再回去，或者更确切地说，许多论坛消亡是因为他们的主题变得不热门。

There is no intrinsic value of separate domains, as if Yet Another PHPBB Forum with the Red Theme is different a Subreddit with the Banana banner.

单独的域没有内在价值，就好像另一个带有红色主题的 PHPBB 论坛与带有 Banana 横幅的 Reddit 子版块不同一样。

And one day, when Reddit fails to serve the needs of the user, people will move on to another platform. But the reality is, the actual facts of this discussion, is you don't want to host and run a forum of 10-100 people. You're acting like forum culture was a million bodybuilding.com, when in reality it was TieDyeForum.com with 20 active users. That's why you don't do it and that's why you don't use them.

有一天，当 Reddit 无法满足用户的需求时，人们就会转向另一个平台。 但现实是，这次讨论的实际事实是，您不想主持和运营一个 10-100 人的论坛。 你表现得好像论坛文化是一百万个 bodybuilding.com，而实际上它是拥有 20 个活跃用户的 TieDyeForum.com。 这就是为什么你不这样做，这就是你不使用它们的原因。

>>109588708

>contrarian

>>109588725

>i believe the authors self insert

>我相信作者自己插入

both wrong

都错了

t.enlightened centrist

t. 开明中间派

>>109585927

>their cushy Nitro account and Hololive servers

>他们轻松的 Nitro 帐户和 Hololive 服务器

Why are you mad at retards for being retarded? Find other friends whose entire lives aren't spent watching adult Teletubbies

为什么你会因为智障而对智障生气？寻找其他一生都没有花在看成人天线宝宝上的朋友

>>109588560

>shareholders of 4chan inc

>4chan inc 股东

Wrong.

There is an LLC. Maybe 2 LLCs. Worth looking into.

有一个有限责任公司。也许有 2 个有限责任公司。值得研究一下。

You should learn the difference between an LLC and a corporation. 4chan Community Support LLC is an LLC, not a corporation.

您应该了解有限责任公司和公司之间的区别。 4chan 社区支持有限责任公司是一家有限责任公司，而不是一家公司。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787075269971509.png

>>109588823

Retarded or just

迟钝或只是

>tripfaggot

Classic combo.

经典组合。

Try google next time.

下次试试谷歌。

>>109588823

>llc

>limited liability corporation

>有限责任公司

>>109588837

LLCs are not *real* corporations.

有限责任公司不是“真正的”公司。

Real corporations bear "Inc"

真正的公司带有“Inc”字样

LLCs are LLCs. They are not addressed with "inc"

有限责任公司就是有限责任公司。他们没有用“inc”来称呼

You lack nuance

你缺乏细微差别

>>109588657

>On forums, posts live for longer

>在论坛上，帖子的存活时间更长

You can get Reddit results from 10 years ago if you Google something

如果你谷歌一些东西，你可以得到 10 年前的 Reddit 结果

>>109588751

>it's about expanding your awareness of what's out there and different ways of solving problems.

>它是关于扩大你对外面的事物和解决问题的不同方法的认识。

It won't help

这不会有帮助

>>109588848

I will add onto my own post, these are the kinds of services a corporation provides. 4chan Community Support LLC, has a business relationship with Capitol Services Inc, they handle various legal aspects for 4chan Community Support LLC, and as far as I can tell seem to be a pretty good corporation, at least for business purposes. I don't know anything about their ethics, who or what they fund, but it might be worth looking into, if you're interested.

我将在我自己的帖子中添加这些是公司提供的服务。 4chan Community Support LLC 与 Capitol Services Inc 有业务关系，他们为 4chan Community Support LLC 处理各种法律事务，据我所知，这似乎是一家相当不错的公司，至少出于商业目的。我对他们的道德规范、他们资助的对象或资助内容一无所知，但如果你感兴趣的话，可能值得研究一下。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787075698412745.png

>>109588848

>You lack nuance

>你缺乏细微差别

Absolutely ironic given your pedantry.

考虑到你的迂腐，这绝对是讽刺。

>>109588899

I have been pedantic in the past, and at times maybe I am still pedantic, for example, when I used to be a cashier, as a part of my duties in a managerial position, I was pedantic when it came to money in the till. If a customer was short even a penny, I would refuse the transaction. I followed the corporate policy on how to handle such situations to the letter, and I was known for being a dick about it, but my district manager appreciated it, and definitely took advantage of it.

我过去很迂腐，有时也许我仍然很迂腐，比如我以前当收银员的时候，作为管理岗位职责的一部分，涉及收银台的钱的时候我很迂腐。如果客户缺一分钱，我就会拒绝交易。我严格遵守了公司关于如何处理此类情况的政策，而且我在这方面以混蛋着称，但我的地区经理很欣赏这一点，并且确实利用了这一点。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787075935188615.jpg

>>109585927

Normoids are retarded NPCs and the jews are right about them. What is new here?

诺莫人是智障的 NPC，犹太人对他们的看法是正确的。这里有什么新内容？

>>109588766

I highlighted some reasons why subreddits and discord are worse experiences than forums, I think most people would agree with them.

我强调了为什么 subreddits 和不和谐的体验比论坛更糟糕的一些原因，我认为大多数人都会同意它们。

Yes, forums still "exist" but what's the point when they're down to a sliver of the population? For example, 15-20 years ago my country had a moderately active anime forum, now it gets 5-10 posts a month. And fuck discord as an alternative, the only reason people use it is because they're already glued to their phones because of endless dopamine harvest algorithms.

是的，论坛仍然“存在”，但当它们只占人口的一小部分时，还有什么意义呢？例如，15-20年前，我国有一个活跃度还算活跃的动漫论坛，现在每月有5-10个帖子。作为替代方案，人们使用它的唯一原因是因为无休止的多巴胺收获算法，他们已经粘在手机上。

>>109588865

But with zero discussion. On forums a thread could have a discussion with multiple users joining in for multiple days. This never happens on reddit.

但零讨论。在论坛上，一个帖子可以与多个用户进行多天的讨论。这在 Reddit 上从来不会发生。

>>109588967

>This never happens on reddit.

> 这在 Reddit 上从来没有发生过。

Yes it does

是的，确实如此

Have you even been to Reddit?

你去过 Reddit 吗？

>>109588985

What happens in every comment chain is that two people keep replying to one another. Perhaps OP or some rando will also chime in but the comment chain's discussion will never be in the forefront, as it would be on a forum (or here).

每个评论链中都会发生两个人不断互相回复的情况。也许OP或一些rando也会插话，但评论链的讨论永远不会像在论坛（或这里）上那样位于最前沿。

>>109588967

>I think most people would agree with them.

>我想大多数人都会同意他们的观点。

They wouldn't, which is why Reddit / Discord has replaced forums

他们不会，这就是 Reddit / Discord 取代论坛的原因

Reddit is superior for disseminating information

Reddit 在传播信息方面更胜一筹

Discord is superior for hanging out

Discord 更适合闲逛

>>109589012

I'm literally speaking to a guy who doesn't know how to use Reddit in 2026

我实际上是在和一个 2026 年还不知道如何使用 Reddit 的人说话

>>109589018

so you believe that what is discussed in a 10-comments deep chain has the same visibility as the most upvoted top-level comment? are you delusional?

那么您认为 10 条评论深链中讨论的内容与获得最多支持的顶级评论具有相同的可见性吗？你有妄想症吗？

>>109589018

If you are in marketing and aren't using reddit, you're fucking braindead. Google is what the majority of people on earth use for search. It's well known that people append reddit to whatever they ask to get better insights. So now Gemini is on Google search for the people who use chrome by default. These gemini search results are directly driven by reddit. Therefore, if you can improve your reddit SEO, you inherently improve your GEO, because most of the LLMs, when they do a web search, they are queering against Google search, either directly or indirectly.

如果你从事营销工作而不使用 Reddit，那你就真是脑残了。地球上大多数人都使用谷歌进行搜索。众所周知，人们会将 reddit 附加到他们提出的任何问题上以获得更好的见解。所以现在 Gemini 出现在 Google 搜索中，默认使用 chrome 的用户。这些 Gemini 搜索结果直接由 reddit 驱动。因此，如果你能提高你的reddit SEO，你本质上就会提高你的GEO，因为大多数法学硕士，当他们进行网络搜索时，他们直接或间接地反对谷歌搜索。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787076796223424.jpg

>>109589050

You can have discussion chains on Reddit, it just puts the most popular posts at the top

你可以在 Reddit 上建立讨论链，它只是将最受欢迎的帖子放在顶部

>>109588967

>For example, 15-20 years ago my country had a moderately active anime forum, now it gets 5-10 posts a month. And fuck discord as an alternative, the only reason people use it is because they're already glued to their phones because of endless dopamine harvest algorithms.

>例如，15-20年前，我国有一个比较活跃的动漫论坛，现在每月有5-10个帖子。作为替代方案，人们使用它的唯一原因是因为无休止的多巴胺收获算法，他们已经粘在手机上。

Then that's just an argument about the state of culture, not the internet, you even admit the forum still exists. I already explained why people don't use forums. And for discussing anime, guess what works really well for this? Reddit. Or if you want it a little more personal? Discord. The forum still exists, the users who used the forums still exist, the discussions are still happening, the only difference is the platform. You are pining for something only on the premise that "past == good" not "can users still do the thing today that they did in the past, e.g. talk about anime with likeminded people in [foreign language]". And that's not even talking about the cultural shift, do you actually think that if Reddit and Discord disappeared magically tomorrow that the core cultural rot of brain rotted zoomers will disappear? You're going to be an estranged dinosaur no matter the architecture or platform. You're really no different from someone telling stories about that one time in high school when they made the game winning play and then complaining why life isn't high school.

那么这只是关于文化状况的争论，而不是互联网，你甚至承认论坛仍然存在。 我已经解释了为什么人们不使用论坛。 在讨论动漫时，猜猜什么最适合这个？ 红迪网。 或者如果您想要更个性化一点？ 不和谐。 论坛仍然存在，使用论坛的用户仍然存在，讨论仍然在发生，唯一的区别是平台。 你所渴望的只是在“过去==好”的前提下，而不是“用户今天还能做他们过去做过的事情，例如用[外语]与志同道合的人谈论动漫”。 这甚至不是在谈论文化转变，你真的认为如果 Reddit 和 Discord 明天神奇地消失，那么大脑腐烂的 Zoomers 的核心文化腐烂就会消失吗？ 无论架构或平台如何，你都将成为一只疏远的恐龙。 你真的和那些在高中时讲述他们赢得比赛的故事然后抱怨为什么生活不是高中的人没有什么不同。

>>109589050

>visibility

Way to out the real motivation, you're not interested in discussion, you're interested in visibility... the grift. Hate to break it to you, I scrolled past your posts on forums without reading either.

要想找出真正的动机，你对讨论不感兴趣，你对可见性感兴趣……欺骗。 不想打扰你，我在论坛上滚动浏览了你的帖子，也没有阅读。

>>109589079

reddit is enforcing a mainstream opinion by its upvote desing. Its a downgrade to a forums egalitarian structure where posts all get equal attention. Especially as votes are trivially manipulated by social rejects doing their own style of moderation.

Reddit 通过其点赞设计来强化主流观点。这是对论坛平等主义结构的降级，所有帖子都得到平等的关注。尤其是当选票被社会拒绝者以自己的方式进行节制时，微不足道地操纵了。

>>109589123

>Especially as votes are trivially manipulated by social rejects doing their own style of moderation.

>尤其是当选票被社会拒绝者以自己的方式进行节制时，微不足道地操纵了。

Forums are manipulated by social rejects who spend all day on there replying to every post

论坛被社交拒绝者操纵，他们整天都在那里回复每个帖子

>>109589050

There are some interesting studies on tangibly related topics.

有一些关于切实相关主题的有趣研究。

>>109589143

Somewhat true, but the companies (like reddit) have far more manipulative and perverse control.

有点正确，但这些公司（如 reddit）拥有更多的操纵性和不正当的控制权。

>>109589151

>Somewhat true

> 有点真实

No it's very true

不，这是真的

If you were around on the internet in the 2000s you'd be sick to fucking death of forums and the rigid social structure they naturally gravitate towards

如果你在 2000 年代上网，你一定会厌倦论坛和他们自然倾向于的僵化社会结构

I don't use Reddit but it's a breath of fresh air compared to a forum

我不使用 Reddit，但与论坛相比，它是一股新鲜空气

>>109589079

Each platform influences the conversation quality in it. If your post doesn't get enough upvotes while it's "new" on reddit, it won't be shown on most people's feed. Sure you can browse by new but 99% of the users are not doing that, which is the problem.

每个平台都会影响其中的对话质量。如果您的帖子在 Reddit 上是“新”帖子时没有获得足够的支持，那么它不会显示在大多数人的动态中。当然你可以按新浏览，但 99% 的用户不这样做，这就是问题所在。

>>109589107

It's not about me, it's about the "default" way to use each platform, but you're too dense to understand it

这与我无关，而是关于使用每个平台的“默认”方式，但你太密集而无法理解它

>>109589123

it's wild that you can be contrarian enough to defend reddit in 2026

2026 年，你能逆势而行，捍卫 Reddit，这太疯狂了

>>109589123

Every subreddit has its own culture, your critique only applies as a generalization if you're lamenting the discussion quality of /r/funnypicsIshareintheshower then you're just being bad faith. And your core assertion is wrong to imply every comment is equally valid or deserves equal visibility and from what I recall, attention whores often got banned in forums, especially those that insisted their comments demand visibility. YOU were the cancer on forums, big fish in a small pond. But funny really, I'd swear you're a subreddit moderator.

每个 Reddit 子版块都有自己的文化，如果您感叹 /r/funnypicsIshareintheshower 的讨论质量，那么您的批评仅适用于概括，那么您只是不诚实。 你的核心主张是错误的，暗示每条评论都同样有效或值得同等的可见性，据我记得，注意力妓女经常在论坛中被禁止，尤其是那些坚持认为自己的评论需要可见性的人。 你是论坛上的毒瘤，小池塘里的大鱼。 但真的很有趣，我发誓你是 Reddit 版主。

I also can't help but notice you are likely making the chronical lament now because you feel your comments are buried. But if you were a top poster that got frequently updooted you'd be all in. Maybe the problem is Reddit is a mirror of your commentary value.

我也忍不住注意到你现在可能会长期哀叹，因为你觉得你的评论被埋葬了。 但如果你是一位经常被转发的顶级发帖者，你就会全力以赴。也许问题是 Reddit 是你评论价值的一面镜子。

>>109589167

No I like and miss some forums. I was on many traditional MyBB forums, I think forums are good and we need more of them.

不，我喜欢并且怀念一些论坛。我上过很多传统的 MyBB 论坛，我认为论坛很好，我们需要更多。

https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0344782

https://sllives.com/how-reddit-comments-influence-post-visibility-in-large-subreddits/

https://arxiv.org/pdf/1705.02673

>>109589190

forums are shit because they become cliquey

论坛很糟糕，因为它们变成了小集团

>>109589202

Is hackforums cliquey? Is there a clique that forms around the administrator, "omniscient"?

黑客论坛是小集团吗？是否存在围绕管理员“无所不知”的派系？

btw, here's a good reason not to use hackforums

顺便说一句，这是不使用 hackforums 的充分理由

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787077970660051.png

>>109589168

>Each platform influences the conversation quality in it. If your post doesn't get enough upvotes while it's "new" on reddit, it won't be shown on most people's feed. Sure you can browse by new but 99% of the users are not doing that, which is the problem.

>每个平台都会影响其中的对话质量。如果您的帖子在 Reddit 上是“新”帖子时没有获得足够的支持，那么它不会显示在大多数人的动态中。当然你可以按新浏览，但 99% 的用户不这样做，这就是问题所在。

So you just want attention? You know if updoots is how you base your self-esteem or value of your argument then you should change your rhetoric to the forum, this is Communication 101.

所以你只是想要关注？ 你知道，如果 updoots 是你自尊或论点价值的基础，那么你应该改变你在论坛上的言论，这是沟通 101。

>It's not about me, it's about the "default" way to use each platform, but you're too dense to understand it

>这不是关于我的，而是关于使用每个平台的“默认”方式，但你太密集了，无法理解它

It is about you, that's why you used the word visibility and why you complain so much about traction. Reddit is easy to game if you know the words. And I don't know why you think this is worse than a forum topic with 99 pages and your comment buried on page 87. You seem obsessed with the fact that your post isn't front and center. You know you can just make a website where you can blog with zero competing attention right? Or is it you must have lots of attention and at little personal expense?

这是关于你的，这就是你使用可见性这个词的原因，也是你如此抱怨牵引力的原因。 如果你认识单词的话，Reddit 很容易玩。 我不知道为什么你认为这比 99 页的论坛主题和你的评论埋在第 87 页更糟糕。你似乎痴迷于你的帖子不在前面和中心这一事实。 您知道您可以创建一个可以在零竞争关注的情况下写博客的网站吗？ 或者你是否必须投入大量的注意力并且花费很少的个人费用？

>>109589212

I've never been to your favourite forum bro

我从来没有去过你最喜欢的论坛兄弟

>>109589187

i can bot upvotes on any subreddit and control discourse without posting anything.

我可以在任何 Reddit 子版块上投票并控制讨论，而无需发布任何内容。

There are also services for this available and i had offers to write bots for reddit on my freelance profile.

还有这方面的服务可用，并且我在我的自由职业者个人资料中提出了为 Reddit 编写机器人的提议。

Forums can suffer sliding spamming nonsense posts but its obvious.

论坛可能会遭受滑动垃圾邮件无意义帖子的困扰，但这是显而易见的。

>>109589237

My favorite forum would have to have been RaidForums or NulledBB, if I had to pick I would pick NulledBB.

我最喜欢的论坛必须是 RaidForums 或 NulledBB，如果我必须选择的话，我会选择 NulledBB。

>>109589250

I didn't ask

我没问你

>>109589262

You did indirectly

你间接做到了

>>109589240

That is completely irreverent to the points I made, and if it's so easy to bot and visibility is your prime concern then bot your own posts, it's easy! right? Seems like a utopia for you, endless visibility with the hottest posts, you'll be on the late night shows for sure.

这完全不尊重我提出的观点，如果它很容易被机器人攻击并且可见性是您最关心的问题，那么对您自己的帖子进行机器人攻击，这很容易！正确的？ 对您来说，这似乎是一个乌托邦，最热门的帖子永远可见，您肯定会出现在深夜节目中。

>>109589240

I don't need to bot upvotes at all. If you need to bot upvotes you are doing it wrong.

我根本不需要机器人投票。如果您需要机器人投票，那么您就错了。

>>109589272

you have a narcissists perspective. I dont care about my posts. My concern is merely that a few retards control the entire website because they have more influence with botting than the regular users do.

你有自恋者的观点。我不关心我的帖子。 我担心的只是一些弱智控制了整个网站，因为他们对机器人的影响力比普通用户更大。

Its just a marketing platform distributing fake popular opinions to normies.

它只是一个向普通人传播虚假流行观点的营销平台。

Your sites are probably vibecoded slop, explains why nobody wants to use it

您的网站可能是 vivicoded slop，解释了为什么没有人想使用它

>>109589292

lmao your whole perspective is about attention, a bunch of idiots talking about things they don't know anything about is nothing new

lmao，你的整个观点都是关于注意力，一群白痴谈论他们一无所知的事情并不是什么新鲜事

so the real question is what your motivation is, so let's not project that onto me, it's not me complaining about updoots on reddit and crying about forums dying -- as if forums were some epic concentration of intellectual discussion

所以真正的问题是你的动机是什么，所以我们不要把这个投射到我身上，这不是我在抱怨 Reddit 上的 updoots 或为论坛的消亡而哭泣——就好像论坛是知识讨论的史诗般的集中地

it's okay anon, you're a displaced forum moderator that isn't up to snuff on reddit because even reddit bullies you for being a tyrant

没关系，你是一个流离失所的论坛版主，在 Reddit 上不合格，因为连 Reddit 都欺负你是暴君

>>109589292

If you are in marketing, or your goal is to market something, you should probably engineer your marketing to be palatable to the group you are marketing the product to.

如果您从事营销工作，或者您的目标是推销某些产品，那么您可能应该设计您的营销方式，使其适合您要向其营销产品的群体。

There are different angles you can use to market something. Propose you were to be selling something, say, women's shampoo products. What can I say to convince a hypothetical woman to purchase my women's shampoo product. Well, the first thing I would do is to research what appeals to women in general, and measure what is successful in appealing to women. I used Yandex to search for this and found this: http://www.inquiriesjournal.com/articles/826/appealing-to-women-an-analysis-of-print-advertisements-in-three-womens-interest-magazines

I prompted Claude Opus 4.8 with this:

我用这个提示 Claude Opus 4.8：

"http://www.inquiriesjournal.com/articles/826/appealing-to-women-an-analysis-of-print-advertisements-in-three-womens-interest-magazines

Distill this into key actionable marketing insights. I am now looking to market my shampoo to women. How can I do this?"

将其提炼为关键的可操作的营销见解。我现在希望向女性推销我的洗发水。我该怎么办？”

For brevity, I will spare you the full output, but Claude gave this

为了简洁起见，我不会向您提供完整的输出，但克劳德给出了这个

A strong shampoo ad based on this research would combine:

基于这项研究的强有力的洗发水广告将结合以下内容：

A clear performance promise (headline)

明确的绩效承诺（标题）

Ingredient proof points (supporting copy)

成分证明点（支持副本）

An emotionally resonant photo of a relatable woman enjoying the result

一张情感共鸣的照片，照片中一位有亲和力的女性正在享受结果

A sensory/social hook (scent, ritual, or compliments)

感官/社交挂钩（气味、仪式或赞美）

A frictionless "where to buy" call to action.

无摩擦的“在哪里购买”号召性用语。

One caveat: this study is from 2013 and focused on print magazine ads. The underlying psychology (emotion, performance, ingredients, relatable imagery) translates well to digital and social channels, but you'll want to adapt formats—short video, influencer content, and user-generated "results" posts are the modern equivalents of the celebrity/relatable-person approach the study praised.

需要注意的是：这项研究始于 2013 年，重点关注印刷杂志广告。潜在的心理学（情感、表现、成分、相关图像）可以很好地转化为数字和社交渠道，但你需要适应格式——短视频、有影响力的内容和用户生成的“结果”帖子是该研究赞扬的名人/相关人物方法的现代等同物。

If you'd like, I can help you draft actual ad copy, a tagline, or a channel-specific campaign plan (Instagram, TikTok, retail) tailored to your shampoo's specific differentiator.

如果您愿意，我可以帮助您起草实际的广告文案、口号或针对您的洗发水的特定差异化特征的特定渠道营销计划（Instagram、TikTok、零售）。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787078927127533.jpg

>>109589232

visibility is not all about attention you faggot, it also helps people get exposed to niche topics, media, tech, whatever. If you post about something niche on reddit, people don't know it and it gets buried down if it's a comment or not shown to anyone if it's a post. At least on forums there's a chance someone will notice it during the few days your post is at page 1, or maybe someone who uses the forum as their go-to place about X will search about it and revive your post, generating discussion

可见度不仅仅在于关注你这个基佬，它还可以帮助人们接触利基主题、媒体、技术等等。如果你在 Reddit 上发布一些小众的内容，人们并不知道它，如果它是评论，它就会被埋没；如果它是帖子，它不会向任何人显示。至少在论坛上，有人可能会在您的帖子位于第 1 页的几天内注意到它，或者可能使用论坛作为有关 X 的首选位置的人会搜索它并恢复您的帖子，从而产生讨论

>>109589399

are you dumb?

你是傻子吗？

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787079325991948.png

>>109589354

my perspective is people are getting misled on a platform that pretends to be user content but is really just dominated by viral marketers. And idiots doing stupid shit on command was always a problem for everyone longterm.

我的观点是，人们在一个假装是用户内容但实际上只是由病毒式营销人员主导的平台上被误导了。从长远来看，白痴按照命令做蠢事始终是每个人的问题。

>>109589416

thank god you're here to be the truth auditor

感谢上帝，你来这里是为了成为真相审计员

>>109589427

and whats your role? bitch&moan constantly? Born to be karen?

你的角色是什么？不断地抱怨？天生就是凯伦？

>>109589412

how does this help when you're the one making the post?

当您是发帖人时，这有什么帮助？

>>109589412

I made a custom sorting algorithm that indexes /g/ by quality (with metrics i defined for ascertaining content quality)

我制作了一个自定义排序算法，按质量对 /g/ 进行索引（使用我定义的用于确定内容质量的指标）

I use it sometimes

我有时用它

>>109585927

>Whenever I make a FOSS social media, alternative to Discord or whatever, people reject it aggressively.

>每当我制作自由开源软件社交媒体，替代 Discord 或其他任何东西时，人们都会强烈拒绝它。

well stop fucking making them then and grow the one you already have

那我们就别再做它们了，种你已经拥有的那个吧

>>109589444

whoa there anon I can only hold up so many mirrors

哇哦，我只能举起这么多镜子

I'm trying to help you work through this temper tantrum so that you can come to the logical conclusion that you're the problem

我正在努力帮助你克服这种脾气，这样你就可以得出合乎逻辑的结论：你就是问题所在

my role is more like jester or troll, I need no external validation because my actions amuse me

我的角色更像是小丑或巨魔，我不需要外部验证，因为我的行为让我感到有趣

>>109589445

whoa there anon, this isn't about your own personal validation and visibility remember?

哇哦，这不是关于你自己的个人验证和知名度，还记得吗？

>>109589476

wow, you're retarded.

哇，你智障了。

>>109589577

I can't help it if you can't remember your own arguments because you lie about your motivations. Ironic given your title of Arbiter of Truth while employed in the Anti-Misinformation Division. I would hope in the future you can keep straight if you're mad about lack of attention due to algorithmic suppression vs an appeal against the masses having dumb opinions on a platform you hate.

如果你因为在动机上撒谎而记不住自己的论点，我也没办法。 具有讽刺意味的是，您在反错误信息部门工作期间获得了真理仲裁者的头衔。 我希望将来，如果你对算法压制导致的缺乏关注感到愤怒，而不是对你讨厌的平台上有愚蠢观点的大众提出上诉，你可以保持正直。

>>109589606

you're replying to two different people, idiot

你在回复两个不同的人，白痴

>>109588395

BSD is freedom, GPL is not.

BSD 是自由，GPL 不是。

>>109590069

BSD is giving you a gun with no safety. GPL is the same gun, but it's a Glock.

BSD 给你一把没有安全保障的枪。 GPL 是同一把枪，但它是一把格洛克。

>>109590080

what?

>>109590107

It's a metaphor.

这是一个比喻。

BSD = Go ahead, be a retard and shoot yourself.

BSD = 来吧，做个弱智，然后开枪自杀。

GPL = No, I will not allow you to do that. I will take you to court and prevent you from killing yourself. I will exercise all legal means at my disposal to litigate and destroy you if you trample on my rights. I do not give you permission to use my source code in your proprietary project without sharing alike.

GPL = 不，我不会允许你这样做。我会把你告上法庭，阻止你自杀。如果你践踏我的权利，我将动用一切合法手段起诉并消灭你。我不允许您在不进行类似共享的情况下在您的专有项目中使用我的源代码。

It's really just that simple. I was fooled once into thinking that BSD was the "freer" option, it is not. I sometimes license my work under the BSD license, the CC0 license, or the GPL, or the AGPLV3. I do not have to be consistent with the license I choose for my works, and neither do you nor does anyone.

真的就是这么简单。我曾经被愚弄，以为 BSD 是“更自由”的选择，但事实并非如此。我有时会根据 BSD 许可证、CC0 许可证、GPL 或 AGPLV3 来许可我的作品。我不必与我为我的作品选择的许可保持一致，你和任何人也不需要。

Hope that helps.

希望有帮助。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787085460055562.jpg

>>109585927

Look man. You should just accept like Skype and Teamspeak did. there will only ever be one voice chat app people will use. It can be the shittest app in the world, but because everyone uses Discord, the only place to go is Discord. This isn't psychology, this is pragmatic. Once Discord tips over for the last time, the next competitor will stick. But you and I don't know when that last time is gonna be, just as Skype didn't know. But it came fast, hit hard, and now Skype is useless. Because whats a communication app if theres no one to communicate with?

瞧，伙计。你应该像 Skype 和 Teamspeak 那样接受。人们只会使用一款语音聊天应用程序。它可能是世界上最糟糕的应用程序，但因为每个人都使用 Discord，所以唯一的去处就是 Discord。这不是心理学，这是实用主义。一旦 Discord 最后一次倒下，下一个竞争对手就会坚持下去。但你和我都不知道最后一次是什么时候，就像 Skype 不知道一样。但它来得快，打击重，现在Skype已经没用了。因为如果没有人可以交流，那还有什么通讯应用程序呢？

>>109590069

GPL is freedom for all normal people. If you're a fucking bastard that wants to make money while standing atop other people's shoulders, then you get rightfully fucked up the ass and out of the mouth sideways, as it should be.

GPL 是所有普通人的自由。如果你是一个他妈的混蛋，想站在别人的肩膀上赚钱，那么你理所当然地会从侧面把屁股搞砸，就像应该的那样。

>>109586777

Good advice to focus on having actual features.

专注于拥有实际功能的好建议。

You need to have the "killer app" mindset. What thing distinguishes you from others? If you don't offer anything new what incentive is there to switch? Removing features everything else has is also a good idea because so many of them are terrible and interfere with user experience.

您需要拥有“杀手级应用”的心态。你与其他人的区别是什么？如果你不提供任何新的东西，有什么动力去改变呢？删除其他所有功能也是一个好主意，因为其中很多功能都很糟糕并且会干扰用户体验。

>>109590476

>Removing features everything else has is also a good idea because so many of them are terrible and interfere with user experience.

>删除其他所有功能也是一个好主意，因为其中很多功能都很糟糕并且会干扰用户体验。

Yes, it's the google strategy (offer the core product and nothing but the core product, not a billion switches and gizmos to get a first search result).

是的，这就是谷歌的策略（只提供核心产品，只提供核心产品，而不是通过十亿个开关和小玩意来获得第一个搜索结果）。

>>109588139

You are peripheral to correct. The core idea is right - the base audience (most frequent/heavy users) of any tech product are inherently fucked up people who would spend all of their time on some app. These people also fuck it up for everyone else and shit up the public spaces. The answer is to pay attention to this and find ways to remedy it. Discouraging the obsessed super user, who is usually a deranged shut-in of some kind, isn't as hard as you think.

你是外围纠正。核心思想是正确的——任何科技产品的基本受众（最频繁/重度用户）本质上都是那些会把所有时间都花在某个应用程序上的人。这些人还把其他人搞得一团糟，把公共场所搞得一团糟。答案就是要重视这一点并想办法补救。阻止痴迷的超级用户（通常是某种疯狂的闭门者）并不像您想象的那么难。

>>109585927

>when I link a video to some friend on Discord

>当我在 Discord 上将视频链接到某个朋友时

You're interacting with cattle. This is why.

你正在与牛互动。这就是原因。

>>109588873

>It won't help

>这不会有帮助

It can. In relation to the example I gave, the more interesting parts of data-oriented design (beyond muh structure of arrays) are largely attempts at carrying over ideas from database programming into local software optimization.

可以。就我给出的例子而言，面向数据的设计中更有趣的部分（超出了数组的多种结构）主要是尝试将数据库编程的思想转移到本地软件优化中。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787093416667730.png

>>109585927

I started a phpBB forum last year and it gets daily posts and has cultivated a small userbase. For me what worked is identifying people who were interested in both the main topic (which if you're starting a project like this you need some sort of unique hook that isn't being done elsewhere) AND interested in alternatives to social media. You can find these people in more technically inclined spaces usually, but also browsing normie social media for people who have posting habits that would fit in was a big thing too.

我去年创建了一个 phpBB 论坛，每天都有帖子，并培养了一个小用户群。对我来说，有效的方法是确定对主要主题感兴趣（如果您要启动这样的项目，您需要某种其他地方没有的独特钩子）和对社交媒体替代品感兴趣的人。你通常可以在更倾向于技术的空间中找到这些人，但浏览规范的社交媒体，寻找那些有适合的发帖习惯的人也是一件大事。

In my case what I'd do is look for Xitter posters who had lots of multi-tweet posts or whatever the fuck they do to uncap the character limit, find Steam profiles with long articulate game reviews, find people who already have a presence on some alternative sites but haven't committed to anyone place, etc. Then I simply reached out to them directly, talk to them about stuff I noticed after lurking their online presence, and eventually I drop the link at an appropriate time. If you run a platform like this it's really easy to naturally sneak it into the conversation and I've had a far better return on investment through direct correspondence than I have via public advertising.

就我而言，我要做的就是寻找拥有大量多推文帖子的 Xitter 海报，或者他们为解除字符限制所做的任何事情，找到带有长篇清晰游戏评论的 Steam 个人资料，找到已经在某些替代网站上存在但尚未承诺任何地方的人，等等。然后我只是直接与他们联系，与他们谈论我在潜伏他们的在线存在后注意到的东西，最终我在适当的时间删除了链接。如果你运营一个这样的平台，那么很容易自然地将其融入对话中，而且我通过直接通信获得的投资回报比通过公共广告获得的投资回报要高得多。

>>109588051

>I AM SILLY

>>109585927

>Back then it was "build it and they will come", now it's "fuck off with your shit reddit clone."

>那时是“构建它，他们就会来”，现在是“滚蛋吧你的 Reddit 克隆”。

Maybe stop asking reddit mods opinion.

也许不要再询问 Reddit 模组的意见了。

>>109587802

>FEDiverse

The name itself makes me never trust that site nor even visit it

这个名字本身让我从不信任该网站，甚至访问它

>>109588766

The biggest problem with forums is how atomised they were. If I like anime, cars, and guns then I'm not a member of 3+ forums across 3+ websites. Compare this to plebbit where one account gives me access to infini"forums".

论坛最大的问题是它们的分散程度。如果我喜欢动漫、汽车和枪支，那么我就不是跨 3+ 网站的 3+ 论坛的成员。将此与 plebbit 进行比较，其中一个帐户可以让我访问无限的“论坛”。

Same for Discord.

不和谐也是如此。

Many people ITT are focused on a lack of features or bad UX/UI but none of that shit matters to USER ACQUISITION which is always the key metric, even above user retention.

许多人 ITT 都关注缺乏功能或糟糕的用户体验/用户界面，但这些对于用户获取来说都不重要，用户获取始终是关键指标，甚至高于用户保留率。

>>109588051

>Unironically liking pizzacunt

>非讽刺地喜欢披萨

I've seen it. It's on the internet.

我见过。它在互联网上。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787136158616967.jpg

>>109585927

>when I link a video to some friend on Discord...

>当我在 Discord 上将视频链接到某个朋友时...

I severely doubt this is true unless it doesn't hotlink and the site named is called something along the lines of heilhitlernigga.ru, which yeah its going to raise some eyebrows and if your "friend" doesn't trust you, they're not going to click on it due to how often people get hit by scams, this is just basic common sense even in the ye olde days if you link to some site without context, im not defending technical illiteracy or anything like that its just a plain lack of trust between the sender and receiver which will cause something like this

我严重怀疑这是真的，除非它没有热链接，并且指定的网站被称为类似于 heilhitlernigga.ru 的东西，是的，这会引起一些人的注意，如果你的“朋友”不信任你，他们就不会点击它，因为人们经常受到诈骗，这只是基本常识，即使在过去，如果你链接到一些没有上下文的网站，我不捍卫技术文盲或类似的东西，它只是简单地缺乏发送者和接收者之间的信任会导致这样的事情

>whenever I tell people discord might not be....

>每当我告诉人们不和谐可能不是......

you're correct, but going to random people who really don't care for your opinion isn't really going to solve anything, when discord announced they're going to start age checking 10% of their users earlier this year all of my friend groups worth a damn started to consider their options and we eventually agreed on moving to fluxer when the time comes, I find it difficult to believe that reasonable people don't have any qualms with discord

你是对的，但是随机去找那些真正不关心你意见的人并不能真正解决任何问题，当discord宣布他们将在今年早些时候开始对10%的用户进行年龄检查时，我所有的朋友团体都开始考虑他们的选择，我们最终同意在时机成熟时转向fluxer，我发现很难相信理性的人对discord没有任何疑虑

>getting your project off the ground in 2026....

>在 2026 年启动您的项目......

yeah it does suck I'll give you that, but if you create a project that rivals the alternative in every aspect but popularity people will use it if you play your cards right and start advertising it in the right spaces

是的，它确实很糟糕，我会给你这个，但是如果你创建一个在各个方面都可以与替代方案竞争的项目，但受欢迎程度，如果你正确地发挥你的牌并开始在正确的空间做广告，人们就会使用它

however doing that is actually really fucking difficult, a good example is just about all the discord alternatives fucking suck and heavily lack in features and accessibility people want to have, other than the aforementioned fluxer the amount of clones that are even remotely usable is miniscule, same goes for every major platform out there but they all have some nice alternatives that people do use

然而，这样做实际上真的非常困难，一个很好的例子就是所有不和谐的替代方案都非常糟糕，并且严重缺乏人们想要的功能和可访问性，除了前面提到的 Fluxer 之外，甚至可以远程使用的克隆数量也是微乎其微的，每个主要平台都是如此，但它们都有一些人们确实使用的不错的替代方案

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1787137685531022.jpg

You sound like a faggot who is boring as shit, i wouldnt listen to you even if you had an actual good idea. You should first become a likeable person before pitching ideas to people.

你听起来就像个无聊透顶的基佬，即使你有一个真正的好主意，我也不会听你的。在向人们提出想法之前，你应该首先成为一个讨人喜欢的人。

>>109589167

This only happens on places with annoying power jannies and overbearing moderation, which you shouldn't browse anyway. If there's hardly any moderation then a clique can't develop because active users can't get special treatment if no or few actions are taken. I've used normie forums with light moderation and cliquiness doesn't tend to exist in any real capacity on them, signed up for one site like this with 10-20 years of history and was treated no differently than any other user would be. Saying that all forums are cliquey is like when normalfags act as though all of 4chan is just /pol/.

这种情况只发生在那些有令人讨厌的权力珍妮和专横节制的地方，无论如何你都不应该浏览这些地方。如果几乎没有任何节制，那么派系就无法发展，因为如果不采取或很少采取行动，活跃用户就无法获得特殊待遇。我曾经使用过适度节制的规范论坛，并且在这些论坛上往往不存在任何真正的小圈子，我注册了这样一个具有 10-20 年历史的网站，并且受到的待遇与任何其他用户没有什么不同。说所有论坛都是小集团，就像普通的 4chan 的行为就好像所有的 4chan 都只是 /pol/ 一样。

>>109594906

>if you do the rights things the right way at the right time your project will be successful

>如果你在正确的时间以正确的方式做正确的事情，你的项目就会成功

What a useless post.

多么无用的帖子。

>moving to fluxer when the time comes

>时机成熟时转向助焊剂

Spoiler: they're never going to move.

剧透：他们永远不会移动。

>>109598057

awfully big assumptions to make, consider taking the cocks out of your pessimistic ass before posting

需要做出非常大的假设，在发布之前考虑把你悲观的鸡巴从你的悲观屁股中拿出来

>>109595063

uh oh, melty

呃哦，融化了

>>109598774

You must be 13 years or older to use this internet web sight.

您必须年满 13 岁才能使用此互联网网络视线。