Are we idiocracy yet?

Is it the norm, that most of the work someone does in IT is managment overhead for a project that is somehow still mismanaged? Is everyone just acting incompetent to get paid money to be useless, or are most people actually incompetent and dont know it?

是不是IT行业里大多数工作本质上是项目管理开销，但项目还是被管理得一团糟？是不是所有人都在装无能，好拿钱当废物，还是说大多数人真的无能而不自知？

I am just 23, got interested in coding at 13, went to a good hs, then top uni in my shitty eastern european country and have now been working as a programmer for 3 years. Except for a few autists I know, 95% of my classmates or colleagues were either frauds, retarded or both.

我才23岁，13岁开始对编程感兴趣，上了个好高中，然后进了我那个烂东欧国家最好的大学，现在当程序员已经3年了。除了我认识几个怪人以外，95%的同学或同事要么是骗子，要么是蠢货，要么两者都是。

I am not sharing details, but due to what the company I work for does, I had the displeasure of working with several teams from several different companies and it all feels fake. Nothing ever got done, deadlines for everything are absurdly long and are always missed anyway. In three years there was not one interesting thing to be done, not one thing requiring a neuron activation to get done.

我不细说，但因为我所在公司的业务，我有幸和几家公司的好几个团队合作过，感觉全是假的。什么都没做成过，所有截止日期都荒谬的长，而且反正总是拖。三年里没有一件有趣的事，没有一件事需要动一下脑子才能完成。

I am not saying I am entitled to fun or a fullfilling job. But I am so fucking dissappointed. Is there truly no place to make useful tech? Am I really supposed to sit 8 hours in an office and just pretend, so I make money to spend on consuming?

我不是说我有资格要求有趣或有意义的工作。但我他妈太失望了。难道真的没有地方能做有用的技术吗？我真的得每天在办公室坐8个小时装样子，赚了钱去消费吗？

>inb4 newfag

>新来的预订

>inb4 how do I unsubscribe

>怎么退订预订

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1785702516720533.jpg

>>109439861

apologize for not being to Chinese to God himself and go to Shenzhen

向神本人道歉你不是中国人，然后去深圳

well if you dont like your job at boomercorp maybe try looking into more interesting companies? I'm sure someone out there is doing cool stuff and not just staffing a bunch of useless people, just make sure your ego is ready when you're suddenly not the smartest guy in the room

嗯，如果你不喜欢你在boomer corp的工作，也许可以看看更有意思的公司？我肯定有人在搞很酷的东西，而不是光养一堆没用的人，只是要做好心理准备，当你突然不再是房间里最聪明的那个人时，别让自尊心受不了。

>>109439861

yep that's the norm it's nepo af and unethically lazy inefficient to the max

是啊，这就是常态，纯靠关系进来的，而且不道德地懒散，低效到极点。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1785704911696164.jpg

>>109439861

There's usually whole layer of middle managers between the head of IT and the workers on the bottom who actually do the work, and because of that nothing gets communicated properly. Everyone kisses whoever's ass is higher up the chain in hopes of getting promoted and the people on top never really know what is happening day to day.

IT负责人和底下真正干活的工人之间通常隔着一整层中层管理，正因为这样，什么消息都传不到位。每个人都往上拍马屁指望升职，而上面的人从来不知道日常到底发生了什么。

>>109439861

You simply haven't reached the stage of

你只是还没到那个阶段，

>pretend

yet. Everyone is pretending to be retarded to avoid extra work and those who aren't, well they're just that.

而已。所有人都在装傻来逃避额外工作，而那些不装的，嗯，他们就是真傻。

I work about 15hours real, actual work in a given week, the rest of the time i spend on my side business or open source projects to further my CV.

我一周实际干活大概就15小时，剩下的时间都花在搞副业或者开源项目上刷简历。

Point is, we haven't reached idiocracy, we just never left 1999.

重点是，我们不是退化成了蠢货社会，我们只是从1999年就没走出来过。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1785705297992378.jpg

>>109439861

We are living in a dying society and there is no turning this ship around.

我们活在一个正在衰亡的社会里，这艘船根本没得掉头。

>>109439861

>Except for a few autists I know, 95% of my classmates or colleagues were either frauds, retarded or both.

>除了我认识几个自闭症天才，我95%的同学或同事要么是骗子，要么是傻子，要么两者兼备。

That's most of the industry.

这行业大部分都这样。

The true Idiocracy is watching Idiocracy and thinking that makes you smart.

真正的蠢逼电影是看《蠢蛋进化论》还觉得自己因此变聪明了。

I've seen people freak out and have panic attacks over the fact that humans need electrolytes to live during the heatwave cause electrolytes is the thing they made fun of in the movie so they must not be real *dies of sodium imbalance*

我见过有人因为热浪期间人类需要电解质才能活而吓得惊慌失措、恐慌发作，就因为在电影里电解质是被嘲笑的东西，所以他们肯定不是真的 *死于钠失衡*

>>109439861

>95% of my classmates or colleagues were either frauds, retarded or both.

我超过95%的同学或同事要么是骗子，要么是弱智，要么两者兼是。

That's just your average Slavic person, not really universal

那只是你典型的斯拉夫人，不一定是全球通病。

>>109439861

Yes, unfortunately it’s like this everywhere. The competency crisis is understated if anything.

对，不幸的是哪儿都这样。能力危机要是真说起来还被低估了呢。

If you want enthusiastic colleagues that feel passionate about building things and actually solving problems, I recommend joining an early stage startup. Over time as it grows it will turn into the same reflection of idiocracy though

如果你想要那种充满热情、真心想造东西、解决问题的同事，我建议你加入早期创业公司。不过随着时间推移它壮大后，也会变成同样的蠢逼缩影。

>>109444867

The way that movie is being referenced by complete morons is infuriating. The movie is very clearly just saying that our system is dysgenic because it facilitates retards outbreeding smart people. But instead of trying to figure out how to make a system where the smartest most capable people aren’t being worked to death despite being paid handsomely while retards in slums have third child they can’t afford to support they reference it every time they see someone act stupid. It’s really funny when liberal leftist references it, because if you added more realism to the movie and made the people in the future browner it would be their most hated movie of all time.

那部电影被一群纯傻逼拿来引用真是让人火大。电影明明很清楚地在说我们的体制是劣生学——因为它让蠢人比聪明人生更多孩子。但那些人不去琢磨怎么建立一个体系，让最聪明最能干的人不至于被干到死哪怕收入丰厚，而贫民窟里的蠢逼却生着养不起的第三个娃，反而每次看到有人犯傻就拿来引用。最搞笑的是自由派左翼引用它，因为要是给电影加点现实主义、把未来的人画得更黑一点，那就会成为他们史上最恨的电影。

>>109445023

There is nothing you can do, "smart people" it turns out are just fucking retarded when it comes to life matters. If you are making 200k but still make up excuses to not have kids then theres nothing anyone can do to break you out of your retard stupor

你啥也做不了，“聪明人”结果在生活大事上就是个纯傻逼。你要是年薪20万还找借口不要孩子，那没人能把你从傻逼的麻木里拽出来。

>>109445462

I don't want kids though, it's not an excuse. I still wouldn't want them i I was a billionaire.

我就是不想要孩子，这不是借口。就算我是亿万富翁我也不要。

>>109445494

thats literally an excuse

那特么就是个借口。

>>109439861

Yes, seems to be the norm. Matches my experience completely

对，好像是常态了。跟我经历完全吻合。

>>109445503

An excuse would be something like "I want kids but I don't have the time/money/whatever".

借口应该是像“我想要孩子但没时间/没钱/随便啥”这种。

>>109439861

>muh idiocracy

>我的蠢蛋进化论

Develop some media literacy and then realize the spread idea/behavior of

培养点媒体素养，然后意识到传播那种思想和行为的——

>it's a prediction!

>这是预言！

Is part of the retardation the movie is talking about.

——本身就是电影里说的那种弱智。

Idiocracy is a satire. Satires apply to the current time.

《蠢蛋进化论》是讽刺作品。讽刺适用于当下。

That there are some universal human behaviors doesn't make it a prediction, it just means the satire could apply to 40 years ago, 400 years ago, 4,000 years in the future if the visual content matched what the society of the time could understand.

存在一些普遍的人类行为不代表它是预言，只是说明这讽刺放在40年前、400年前、4000年后都成立，只要视觉内容符合那个时代社会能理解的东西。

>>109445873

>reddit nuspeak

>红迪新话

Go back.

滚回去。

>>109445908

are you the gayest nigger currently on 4chan?

你是当前4chan上最基的尼哥吗？

>>109439861

The president of the wealthiest and most powerful country on the planet is an insider trade-pedophile whose English proficiency is dwarfed by foreigners on 4chan but you are surprised instead about low-level grunts not being Einsteins?

这个星球上最富有最强大国家的总统是个搞内幕交易的恋童癖，英语水平被4chan上的外国人吊打，你却惊讶底层小兵不是爱因斯坦？

>>109439861

>Is everyone just acting incompetent to get paid money to be useless, or are most people actually incompetent and dont know it?

>是不是所有人都在装无能，就为了拿钱混日子，还是大多数人真的无能却自己不知道？

Most people are stupid, don't know how to handle themselves. Most employees who are smart learn to shirk/pad time for work or "break dishes" to not be assigned more work.

大多数人就是蠢，不会做人。那些真正聪明的员工早学会了磨洋工、混工时，或者"摔盘子"——故意把事搞砸，免得被派更多活儿。

Most managers are incompetent. I will explain. After doing my own micro study at the companies I worked for, I realized how stupid middle management is. Most middle managers don't understand what they are managing, and they tend to get performatively obsessed or attached to issues to look like they are working, mostly with minor or insignificant problems or issues. This is episodic and tends to an average of 4 days to two weeks depending on the gravity or visibility of an issue, after which it gets forgotten.

大多数管理者也是废物。我来解释一下。我在自己待过的几家公司做了个小调研，才发现中层管理有多蠢。大部分中层管理者根本不懂自己在管什么，他们倾向于表演式地盯住某个问题不放，显得自己在干活，而且净盯着些鸡毛蒜皮的小事。这种行为是间歇性的，一般持续四天到两周，取决于问题的严重程度或曝光度，然后就被抛到脑后了。

>Am I really supposed to sit 8 hours in an office and just pretend, so I make money to spend on consuming?

>难道我真要每天在办公室坐8小时装样子，就为了赚钱去消费？

Yes. Are you really one of those fucking dumbasses who posts on LinkedIn about how passionate they are about a fucking job? I bet you really, truly, madly believe in whatever drivel mission statement corporations spit out. You're probably one of the motherfuckers who would show up after a nuclear war and say "Hey, where is everybody, don't you want to work and be passionate about this?"

对。你该不会是那种在LinkedIn上发帖说自己对工作多么有热情的白痴吧？我敢打赌你真真切切地相信公司吐出来的那些狗屁使命宣言。你大概是那种核战爆发后还会冒出来说"嘿，人都哪去了，你们不想上班并对这充满热情吗？"的傻逼。

Wake the fuck up dude. Most people in this system are there for a fucking paycheck, that's it. The money stops, I leave. Work is 100% transactional for me. I give my time for my money to my employer, not my passion or my love. I give my passion and my love to my creative outlets outside of work, like my novels, my paintings, and the pottery I'm working on. Either that, or whatever chubby woman I'm currently seeing. But my job? No.

醒醒吧兄弟。这系统里大多数人就是为了一张工资单，仅此而已。钱一停，我立马走人。工作对我来说就是百分之百的交易。我拿时间换钱给我的雇主，不是我的热情或爱。我的热情和爱留给工作之外的创作，比如我的小说、我的画、还有我正在做的陶艺。要么就给我现在约着的那个胖妞。但工作？算了。

>Is there truly no place to make useful tech?

>难道真的没有地方能做有用的技术吗？

The cool shit is made by a select few firms, and even then the cool shit is handled by a very select few.

牛逼的东西是少数几家公司做的，而且就算在那几家里，牛逼的东西也只由极少数人经手。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1785774898753653.jpg

>>109439861

You understand correctly OP. You go to school and beat sort algorithms and calculus into your head then all that's available is webdev making CRUD apps. That's simply what the market wanted, and as you noticed even retards can do it. This might change as AI takes all that low tier stuff off the table.

OP你理解得没错。你上学时把排序算法和微积分硬塞进脑子，结果毕业了能干的只有Web开发、写写CRUD应用。这就是市场需求，而且你也发现了，连傻子都能干这活。这情况可能会变，因为AI正把这些低端活儿从桌上清走。

>>109448801

That's nice, John. See you tomorrow at 8 during our standup, cameras on.

说得真好，John。明天早上8点站会见，记得开摄像头。

>>109445462

Your definition of smart might be wrong or at least very different to what most people think. Smart does not mean making the objectively correct decisions even if there is such thing as objectively correct decision, but rather better describes people who are better informed and are better at problem solving and cognitive tasks. You can do bad decisions as a smart person.

你对"聪明"的定义可能错了，至少跟大多数人想的不一样。聪明不代表做出客观上正确的决定——哪怕存在所谓客观上正确的决定——它更准确地说的是那些信息更充分、解决问题和认知能力更强的人。聪明人照样能做烂决定。

>>109439861

Im 32, been coding professionally for 10 years. Not a single product that i have contribited towards has hit production. I also currently make $150,000 a year. So yea pretty much

我32岁，专业写代码10年了。我参与过的产品一个都没上线过。我现在年薪15万美元。所以对，基本就是这回事。

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1785795973852978.jpg

Economists claim that the reason western populations have x10 or x100 the incomes of third world workers is that they're just that more productive/produce far more value per hour worked. I can't exactly disprove that, but it is a horrifying thought.

经济学家声称，西方人口收入是第三世界工人的10倍或100倍，是因为他们就是效率更高、每小时创造的价值更多。我没法完全反驳这点，但这想法想想都让人不寒而栗。

>>109441067

Good morning sir I can saving your society with simple green card and $38k/yr

早上好啊先生，我可以用一张简单绿卡和年薪3.8万美金拯救你的社会。

>>109445023

I'm pretty sure mike judge is a lolbert and the solution would just be stop subsidizing bastard children and encouraging it. Let them starve and struggle and suffer for their poor decisions and community will start enforcing social values again put of sheer necessity which is where they came from in the first place

我相当确定迈克·贾奇是个自由意志主义者，解决方案无非就是停止补贴那些私生子、别再鼓励生。让他们为自己的烂决策挨饿、挣扎、受苦，社区自然会因为生存需要重新捡起社会价值观——而这些价值观本来就是这么来的。

>>109439861

>Nothing ever got done

>啥事都没办成

Welcome to the "business" world, especially tech.

欢迎来到“商业”世界，尤其是科技圈。

It's all about hype and incestuous buying/selling, where the biggest bullshitters win. If anyone actually want to produce a deliverable then they'd be on a production line or coding themselves.

全是炒作和互相买来卖去，最会吹牛逼的人赢。要是真有人想交出实在成果，那他们早该去生产线或者自己写代码了。

A LOT of jobs exist for the sole purpose of making spreadsheets that only serve the purpose of self-justification.

一大堆工作的存在纯粹是为了做表格，而那些表格的唯一用途就是给自己找存在感。

There are big, profitable companies that have managed to bring deliverables to market (but that means they have to actually work and have tangible responsibility... eww), and MANY companies hope they can bullshit just enough until the big, profitable companies buy them out.

确实有赚钱的大公司把成果推向了市场（但那意味着他们得真干活、担实际责任……恶心），而很多公司则盼着能吹到够久，等大公司来收购他们。

>Is there truly no place to make useful tech?

>难道真的没有地方能做有用的技术吗？

You make it yourself.

你自己做啊。

Even if you just happen to make something while working for someone else they'll either fail to recognize you or brush your work under the rug because it doesn't fit with their ideas.

就算你在别人手下干活时碰巧做出了点东西，他们要么不认你的功劳，要么把你的作品压箱底，因为它不合他们的想法。

Then, you either get REALLY lucky with timing (how most of the big boys got big) or you sell to one of the big boys.

然后，你要么时机巧到爆（大人物基本都是这么起家的），要么就把东西卖给某个大公司。

Seriously.

>>109448801

>oh yeah i have sex guyz!!

>哦耶我有性生活各位！！

>>109452791

There are billion reasons why birthrates are low, you could prevent idiots in slums from reproducing but you will really really struggle making upper middle class and middle class people reproduce. Every theory has been disproven on how to make people reproduce, the only way you can actually do it is by either putting them into human zoo where they live 18th century live like Amish do, or you bomb their country and I still genocidal hatered in the population like you see in Middle East with post-war countries and Orthodox Jews in Israel. The only other predictor is how brown and dumb you are which causes the correlation with wealth and religiosity. Maybe having good financial life in non-urban areas could be it.

出生率低有无数个原因，你可以阻止贫民窟里的蠢人繁衍，但你真是很难让中上阶层和中产阶层的人去生。所有关于怎么让人生孩子的理论都被证伪了，唯一实际可行的办法，要么把他们放进人类动物园里过18世纪阿米什人的生活，要么轰炸他们的国家，在人口中种下种族灭绝式仇恨——就像中东战后国家和以色列正统犹太教徒那样。唯一的其他预测指标就是你有多“褐”和多蠢，这造成了财富与宗教虔诚之间的关联。也许在非城市地区拥有良好的经济生活可能是个方向。

>>109452261

Productivity can be achieved through technology and organization, not pure grit. Say, roads good enough to deliver food on time and avoid wastage, or weaker culture of nepotism, thus less retards in management, etc.

生产率靠技术和组织就能实现，不是纯靠蛮干。比如，道路够好就能准时送食物、减少浪费，或者裙带关系文化弱一些，管理层里的弱智就少点，等等。

>>109439861

>Are we idiocracy yet?

>我们已经进入蠢人国度了吗？

Yes

图片: https://i.4cdn.org/g/1785842295797738.jpg

>>109456489

Birthrates? The [populatoons of places like Ireland have doubled in the last 100 years the native population of Europe has recoverd from WW1 and 2 and there are more native caucasian Europeans now than at at any point in history. Frankly ot would be more comfy if tardswere given less free money and had less kids, the whole falling birthrates means we need immigration thing is a LIE

出生率？像爱尔兰这种地方的人口在过去100年翻了一番，欧洲本土人口已经从一战二战中恢复过来了，现在欧洲本土白人的数量比历史上任何时候都多。说白了，如果少给那些懒鬼白送钱、让他们少生点孩子，反而更舒服。所谓“出生率下降就需要移民”的说辞，纯属谎言。

>>109456843

>deliver food

>送外卖

Meal delivery is a stupid business model (food delivery is actual contaoiners of you know food doing to distribution points or vans of food going to consumers) and only provides black market work for immigrants. Boycott it. The idea that you take a perfectly good hot meal, pay 25% and give it to a rapey eet who handles it on a bicycle and comes to a home as a step in eating means that yes we live in an idiocracy

外卖配送就是个蠢透了的商业模式（真正的食品配送是把食物送到分销点，或者用货车拉去消费者那里），纯粹给移民提供黑市活计。抵制它。你花25%的加价把一个好好的热乎饭交给一个骑自行车、毛手毛脚的货色送到家门口，这竟然成了吃饭的一环，只能说我们确实活在蠢人国里。

>>109439861

I've worked in tech since 1994 and semi retired out of it in 2022. The thrash and tards chasing money arrived during the ,com boom and they have been accumulating ever since

我从1994年就在科技行业干，2022年半退休了。那些追钱的蠢货和跟风狗在.com泡沫时期就涌进来了，之后一直堆积到现在。

HR

Project managers

项目经理

SCUM/Agile

ITIL

JAVA

PYTHON

VB

Visio

Microsoft Project

很抱歉，您只提供了一个项目名称，没有提供需要翻译的论坛帖子内容。请提供完整的英文论坛帖子文本，我会按照您的要求将其翻译成简体中文。

Cloud

Digitisation

Web 2.0

Marketing

Facebook

Google

Amazon

AWS

NIST

GDPR

Twitter

Are all byproducts. Dumb disinterested MBAs and talentless money grubbing deperate little frauds and fakers to make it including the Indians and third wave feminists and faggots have destroyed tech and turned it into a dumpster fire. Framework documents and policies and nonsense churned out b y vegtables for vegtables. LLMs are just the lastest iteration of shit from the 90s. There have been no advances for 20 years. Marketing and HR ALWAYS eats out tech companies and turns them into mediocre advertising agencies, every fucking time. All big government projects ALWAYS fail. Most sucessful 20-30 million turnover SMEs are still on windows server 2008/2012 on premise exchange and MS SQL AD. All that tech is from the 90s incluing mobile data.

都是副产品。一群蠢到无感的MBA、没本事还死要钱的骗子、造假糊弄人的家伙——包括印度人、第三波女权主义者还有那些娘炮——把科技行业毁成了垃圾堆。框架文档和一堆屁政策就是植物人给植物人写的东西。LLM不过是90年代那堆破烂的最新包装罢了。20年了，屁进步都没有。市场部和HR每次都会把科技公司吃干抹净，变成平庸的广告代理，每次都是如此，无一例外。所有政府大项目必烂。大多数成功的、年营业额两三千万的中小企业还在用Windows Server 2008/2012、本地Exchange、MS SQL和AD。这些全他妈是90年代的技术，包括移动数据。

>>109439861

your job, your degree, your friends it's all fake because you live in a fake country

你的工作、你的学位、你的朋友全是假的，因为你活在一个假的国家里。

it's like a gypsy wearing fancy clothes and fake rolex watch except it's your entire life, nothing ever came from your shithole country because your people are shit - this is why they have to pretend because they aren't capable of anything else - just like your average gypsy is not capable of becoming a billionaire

就像吉普赛人穿名牌戴假劳力士，只不过这回是你的整个人生。你的破国家从来产不出任何东西，因为你们的人本身就是垃圾——所以他们只能靠装，别的啥也干不了——就像普通吉普赛人永远成不了亿万富翁一样。

>>109439861

>Are we in Idiocracy yet?

>我们是不是已经进入蠢人国了？

What do you think it was based on?

你觉得那电影是根据什么拍的？

>>109457084

Nigger, I am talking about actual food delivery, eggs in your grocery store don't materialize out of thin air. Poor storage and poor road lead to spoilage and food waste.

黑鬼，我说的是实实在在的食品配送——你超市里的鸡蛋又不是凭空变出来的。储存条件差、道路不行，就导致腐烂和浪费。